Need some info on a Case

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Oilfieldhand
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Need some info on a Case

Postby Oilfieldhand » Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:44 am

I recently picked up this gunstock Case with the Bradford P stamp which would put it pre 1920. No pattern stamp which would be correct for this time period. It’s 2 7/8” long. It’s in really nice condition. Is it a legit case and what would be a ballpark value on it? I don’t have a probe guide on these. Thanks for any help.
27EF226B-F120-4C1F-ADCC-677D4DE96BAE.jpeg
4AB96A9C-36A6-4957-AFFB-2F0C23A9DC4A.jpeg
B3241852-F716-46F0-B1D1-0976CBA5BF9E.jpeg
0E20D0FD-27DD-470C-886F-228896012CA8.jpeg
847DF0BD-8CD0-48ED-8B57-3CFE0D6CA64E.jpeg

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peanut740
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby peanut740 » Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:05 am

I don't think that blade started out in that frame.
Roger

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Sharpnshinyknives
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Sharpnshinyknives » Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:29 am

Oilfieldhand wrote:I recently picked up this gunstock Case with the Bradford P stamp which would put it pre 1920. No pattern stamp which would be correct for this time period. It’s 2 7/8” long. It’s in really nice condition. Is it a legit case and what would be a ballpark value on it? I don’t have a probe guide on these. Thanks for any help. 27EF226B-F120-4C1F-ADCC-677D4DE96BAE.jpeg4AB96A9C-36A6-4957-AFFB-2F0C23A9DC4A.jpegB3241852-F716-46F0-B1D1-0976CBA5BF9E.jpeg0E20D0FD-27DD-470C-886F-228896012CA8.jpeg847DF0BD-8CD0-48ED-8B57-3CFE0D6CA64E.jpeg



Welcome to the forum. From the pictures it looks like the blade was buffed. The spine of the blade looks to have corrosion on it that wasn’t buffed out, but the shiny appearance of the blade and the small pits left behind are tale tale signs of buffing. Lots of disagreement over whether that hurts the value of the knife or not. I think most collectors don’t like seeing buffed blades.
Whether it’s all original or not, I don’t know.
SSk

Oilfieldhand
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Oilfieldhand » Sun Apr 21, 2019 2:59 pm

Thanks for the feedback gentlemen.
Why do you think the blade did not start on this frame?
I don’t think this blade has been polished. There’s no indication on the blade of it ever being touched with anything.
What little history I do know about this knife is that it came from a collection that did not have a knife newer than 1985 and that they all sat in a closet since then.
Thanks again for the feedback.

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Sharpnshinyknives
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Sharpnshinyknives » Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:26 pm

Oilfieldhand wrote:Thanks for the feedback gentlemen.
Why do you think the blade did not start on this frame?
I don’t think this blade has been polished. There’s no indication on the blade of it ever being touched with anything.
What little history I do know about this knife is that it came from a collection that did not have a knife newer than 1985 and that they all sat in a closet since then.
Thanks again for the feedback.



I can’t speak to whether the blade is original to the piece or not. It may be that the photo shows a reflection on the blade that I am seeing as pits. But from what I can see the word Case appears to be partially worn down and it doesn’t look like it’s from opening and closing. The spots on the blades look like pitting that was buffed out. An old blade that is buffed will look very shiny and new except for the wear on the tang stamp and the pitting that remains. You can’t buff a blade down to the bottom of the pit without taking a lot of the surface away and that’s why you usually see the pits. Take a look at this blade under magnification and see if there are polishing marks and look closely at those dark areas on the blade.
If I had it in hand then I could tell for sure. Photos can be deceiving.
SSk

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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Gunsil » Sun Apr 21, 2019 3:52 pm

I agree that the blade probably did not start life in that frame and I agree that the blade has been buffed, so has the frame. The frame has a spun rivet for the center pin, if my memory is working spun rivets began in the mid 1920s. I have also never seen a single blade gunstock jack, but I am not the Case folding knife expert. Let's see what Steve has to say.

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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby gsmith7158 » Sun Apr 21, 2019 4:00 pm

The gunstock pattern with coffin bolster is probably one of the most copied and counterfeited patterns out there . So for that reason I'm always skeptical when I see one. I've never seen a single blade in that pattern. Generally they are 2 Blade jacks with a spear and pen or a clip and pen. The very shiny blade while possible is in most cases unlikely. My vote on this one I'm afraid would be negative.
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby zp4ja » Sun Apr 21, 2019 5:55 pm

Knife has definitely be cleaned in my opinion. Of course difficult to tell with provided pictures.

Greg my friend, are you suggesting the OP knife has coffin bolster? That is not a coffin bolster as I understand it. Could be wrong and if my knowledge is misguided, would love honestly too learn something. Just always thought differently. Additionally I know we all characterize things differently. I think the old CASE 23 frame and 13 frame (IIRC) are only patterns with true coffin bolster.

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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby gsmith7158 » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:04 pm

zp4ja wrote:Knife has definitely be cleaned in my opinion. Of course difficult to tell with provided pictures.

Greg my friend, are you suggesting the OP knife has coffin bolster? That is not a coffin bolster as I understand it. Could be wrong and if my knowledge is misguided, would love honestly too learn something. Just always thought differently. Additionally I know we all characterize things differently. I think the old CASE 23 frame and 13 frame (IIRC) are only patterns with true coffin bolster.

Jerry

My mistake Jerry, the coffin bolsters have the slanted corners and this one doesn't. I should have just characterized it as a Gunstock. I was looking through Sargents and had those two patterns in my head when I posted my thoughts. I still don't think this is correct.
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby 1967redrider » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:07 pm

Great looking gunstock. BUT in my opinion (from the photos) it has been cleaned, polished and buffed. The fact that it is a single blade is somewhat suspect. ::hmm::
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zp4ja
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby zp4ja » Sun Apr 21, 2019 7:43 pm

gsmith7158 wrote:
zp4ja wrote:Knife has definitely be cleaned in my opinion. Of course difficult to tell with provided pictures.

Greg my friend, are you suggesting the OP knife has coffin bolster? That is not a coffin bolster as I understand it. Could be wrong and if my knowledge is misguided, would love honestly too learn something. Just always thought differently. Additionally I know we all characterize things differently. I think the old CASE 23 frame and 13 frame (IIRC) are only patterns with true coffin bolster.

Jerry

My mistake Jerry, the coffin bolsters have the slanted corners and this one doesn't. I should have just characterized it as a Gunstock. I was looking through Sargents and had those two patterns in my head when I posted my thoughts. I still don't think this is correct.


All good Greg. Thought I may have not known something.
I agree the " knife does not feel right" to me.
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby stockman » Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:22 pm

I had a few Bradfords and they had a pattern number.

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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby RalphAlsip » Sun Apr 21, 2019 8:52 pm

Oilfieldhand wrote:I recently picked up this gunstock Case . It’s 2 7/8” long.

The Case 15 pattern is 3" Gunstock frame. There is no documentation, that I am aware of, that indicates the 15 was made in a single blade (6115) configuration. Attached is a picture for reference with a side-by-side comparison of your knife with a Case Tested XX 6215. To my eye, the main blade of the reference 6215 compares favorably to the single LP spear blade in your knife. The size and proportion of the tang on the knife in question seem a little large / tall to me, which could be an optical illusion caused by camera angle or the way the blade frame tapers to the small bolster.

I agree with Harold stockman that Bradford era knives frequently do have pattern numbers. In my experience the pattern number is often stamped on a secondary blade which would support speculation that the knife in question might have been made as a 6215 that has had the secondary blade removed.
Attachments
Case 15 Gunstock Compare.jpg

Oilfieldhand
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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Oilfieldhand » Sun Apr 21, 2019 11:04 pm

Thank you all for the feedback. I’m a bit of a novice on the older stuff.
I’m going to try to take some better pics of the blade. I’ve lookef at it under a magnifying glass and just cannot tell it’s been buffed.
In my research I read that pre 20 knives commonly did not have pattern stamps. Is this in correct or incorrect information I read?
Assuming it is a polished blade and maybe in a different frame then I’d assume there’s not much value to this knife?
Thanks again gentlemen for all the excellent information!

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Re: Need some info on a Case

Postby Mumbleypeg » Mon Apr 22, 2019 12:15 am

Offhand I can’t recall seeing a pre-1920 Case that did not have a pattern number. That doesn’t mean there weren’t some but from my experience a pattern number is the rule, not the exception.

Regarding the OP knife, I’ve been watching this thread with some interest. The only thing I can add is that all the Case Gunstock jacks I have seen, regardless of age, had more than one blade.

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