Robeson pattern number variation

[rcwar56]

I've a Robeson Big Equal End Jack with a never before seen pattern stamping. A typical bone handled big equal end Jack is a 622013. Mine is stamped 62213 (over) 1 - 4. I know a few knife patterns had a 1/2 to indicate a variation of an earlier pattern but I don't know what this 1 - 4 indications. Anyone else seen this before?

[RobesonsRme.com]

As I've written here before, Robeson frequently omitted the first "0" from the three digit handle die shape numbers "001" through "099", creating a whole bunch of knives with a five digit number, instead of six.

Personally, I read all the pattern numbers as a six digit number, automatically inserting that first zero back into the sequence.

As to the "1-4", it is actually "1/4" and will be found stamped both ways.

I have no idea what it might actually mean, other than it indicates a departure from the standard pattern.

You are correct about the "1/2" suffix indicating a different master blade, similar to what Case did, but I think reversed.

You will see that one stamped, "1-2" on some knives.

There were several suffices used, such as "25", "50", "100", "125", "150", "200" and "250", etc.

I left out "175", as I'm not sure I've ever seen that one.

I don't think anyone has figured out what they all mean and Robeson was using these suffices way back in the early 1900's.

One thing we know is if a bail was added to a knife whose pattern did not ordinarily have one, then that knife had a suffix added.

On the OP knife, I do not think an 013 pattern usually had a sabre-cut blade, so that might be what that "1-4" indicates on that particular knife.

Charlie Noyes

[edge213]

Charlie, your knowledge of Robeson Cutlery always impresses me.

[rcwar56]

I figured out the part on the elongation of the 0 in the pattern and then the rest of the pattern numbers made sense. I though the 1 - 4 might have meant 1/4 but unless is noted a variation in the pattern I had no clue. Thanks for help verifying what I was guessing and explaining what I had no clue on. Thanks for your help.

[RobesonsRme.com]

Robert, in your e-mail, you also asked about the dates of the tang stamp.

I used a very liberal dating on the stamps until Tom Kalcevic published his book, Knives Can Talk!. He published some very detailed dates on the known stamps.

Did he know what he was talking about? I don't know. It's his book, he did the research and he lives in the Rochester/Perry, New York area and had access to records and people.

So, now I usually quote Tom and always attribute the information to him.

The ROBESON / ShurEdge (script) / ROCHESTER, N.Y. stamp, he dates 1911 to 1921.

The ROBESON / ShurEdge (script) / ROCHESTER stamp, he dates 1922 to 1939.

Charlie

[RobesonsRme.com]

Thanks, David.

It's mostly misconceptions altered by experience and others.

Charlie

[RobesonsRme.com]

Robert, actually, your 013 knife does not have a sabre-cut spear blade.

It does have a different shield than the one shown in the Robeson section of Bruce Voyles' book and from that pictured in an original early 1900's Robeson catalog.

The 622013 in both those books has an arrow shaped shield, shown below.

Whether a different shield would warrant an added suffix identifier to the pattern number, I do not know, but that is the only difference I see.

Charlie Noyes

[rcwar56]

I'm having horrible connectivity with my AT&T wifi today. Actually for a few months. And so does our whole neighborhood. So right now it won't let me access anything but the last 8 photos out of over 6,000 on my iPad. I stand corrected on the saber spear but there seem to be variations in a spear blade. Most are ground flat and some are like the one on my 013. Why is there a difference but not a different name. I swear I'm not a knife novice but I seem to be having some loss of brain cells lately. But I do appreciate your help on the Rochester stampings and dates

[rcwar56]

I was only able to find one other 013 and it had the same badge as mine but his spear blade was ground flat. Thee pattern number was on the reverse side of the sabre but his was 622013. The 1 - 4 has got to be a variation with the spear blade