storing pocket knives high humidity rusting in rolls

[tnkingfish]

i have around 700 pocket knives mostly case,boker,bulldog, parker, fighting rooster, german eye, ect. i just moved to a house with high humidity and was keeping most of the knives in rolls, now i am having a rust problem what i am wanting to know is can i store them in zip lock bags to prevent rust. i dont have the time to clean and oil them all the time so i am needing long term storage.

[TripleF]

Are they in the basement?

to AAPK!

[jerryd6818]

Not the only solution but a solution is desiccant packs. Google desiccant pack or just go to Amazon
http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&keyword ... ack&page=1

I'm guessing they would work best in an enclosed space. An old refrigerator or freezer would work (no need to plug it in). Ammo boxes, a footlocker, etc, etc.

I used to have an old upright freezer that I used as a gun cabinet, which I kept dry with desiccant packs. When I felt they were losing their ability to absorb humidity, I stuck them in a very low oven for several hours to rejuvenate them. Used the same ones for years. They worked fine.

A sealed space with a dehumidifier.

[tnkingfish]

i keep them in a gun safe in a closet, but the house is surrounded by woods in east Tennessee and has around 70%-75% humidity i run a dehumidifier in the house and it takes it down to 60%-65% where i moved from had a huimidity of less than 50% and i never had a rust problem i also have a little plug in pellet dehumidifier that has to be taken out and pluged in every couple of days so it is out more than in. will keeping them in regualar zip lock bags help prevent rust or just make the rust worst? i have put down a plastic sheeting under the house in crawl space to see if this will cut down on humidity but so far it hasnt

[Iron Hoarder]

Do you have a heat pump or central a/c on the house? If not it would help.

[tnkingfish]

no i use a wood stove in winter and two window air conditioners in summer

[FRJ]

I wouldn't put them in zip lock bags or any plastic bag.
You can't "contain" any thing from humidity. Moisture gets into everything.
Personally, I would get a light coat of oil on them and keep them where they could be aerated(sp) to some degree.

[woseyjales]

I agree with FRJ, ziplocks won't prevent rust.
However they will keep your rust fresher longer.

What you may have here is one of the few exceptions
to the widely held view: You can't have too many knives.

May want to sell 350 and use that money for dehumidifier or A/C.
Then budget your time so that you can properly maintain the
remaining 350.
Unless all of them are rusty in which Case you better sell 699
and start over. (need one to tote right?)
Hope this helps

[tnkingfish]

only a few have rusted so far mostly the fight n roosters, and a few of the bulldogs mostly the celliods. i am putting them in individual mini zip lock bags until my renaissance wax is shipped has anyone had any luck with this wax on knives i hear it is the best

[tnkingfish]

i figure if they are separated if one rusts it wont spread the ones that rusted was together i had about 50 knives with minor surface rust and about 20 that rusted bad.

[Miller Bro's]

Sounds like you have a Celluloid out gassing problem and not so much a humidity problem

I would look closely at all the celluloid handle knives for signs of out gassing and separate them from the rest right away.

[FRJ]

Folks here speak highly of that wax. You're on to something good.

[Ramrod]

Sounds like you have a Celluloid out gassing problem and not so much a humidity problem

I would look closely at all the celluloid handle knives for signs of out gassing and separate them from the rest right away.

[basser5]

I agree with Miller Bros, can you post some pictures of the Fight'n Roosters that are rusting? Fight'n Rooster celluloid is notorious for out gassing.

Tim

[tnkingfish]

im in the process of separating them right now i just ran across a case tested patern 88 greenbone congress that was already in fair condition with some heavy sharpening that the back spring rusted it was right next to a waterfall german eye that rusted seems like the ones on the edges of the rolls rusted and the ones in the middle didnt.

[tnkingfish]

I agree with Miller Bros, can you post some pictures of the Fight'n Roosters that are rusting? Fight'n Rooster celluloid is notorious for out gassing.

Tim

i dont have any pictures and am cleaning the rusted ones with a knife eraser and putting a light coat of 3 in 1 oil until i get the rem wax hope this will work till i get the rem wax it should be here in a week or so most of the rusted ones either are or were next to fighting roosters though so i am putting all the celluloids off by themselves

[tjmurphy]

I don't think that I would use zip lock bags. Any moisture introduced into the bag either from the knives or just from the atmosphere is going to be locked in and will remain a constant.

[tnkingfish]

well i made it through 3 of the rolls about 120 knives im also trying to categorizing so i will know what i have i had over 1200 knives and sold about 500 off last year and i pick up around 100 or so a year. i work at a pawn shop and flea mkt so i get a good variety of knives. does anyone know anything about dixon cutlery co. or sheffield usa? im having trouble finding dates they were made.

[tjmurphy]

See here: http://lib.store.yahoo.net/lib/knifewor ... orlist.pdf Scroll down to Dixon. Can't help you with the Sheffield USA

[tnkingfish]

thanks tjmurphy that site is really helpful. i thought it was around the 20's or 30's

[orvet]

I too am inclined to think you have a celluloid off gassing problem.
If non-celluloid knives are kept with celluloid knives the acid (released in gaseous form) will most definitely affect the other knives. I know a fellow who lost some nice knives because they were in a brief case with 2 off gassing celluloid knives.

If it were my collection I would separate the knives into two groups, celluloid and non-celluloid.
The celluloid knives I would leave on a shelf so the air can circulate around them.
The non-celluloid knives I would put in Ziploc bags, cigar boxes or nearly airtight plastic boxes, (Office Depot has some nice ones, Wal-Mart has some cheaper ones), and put several of the desiccant bags Jerry D posted about. I live in a humid climate in Oregon. That is the way I store my knives and I don’t have problems with rust.

If you put the celluloid knives in rolls, boxes or anything that does not allow the air to flow freely around them and carry away the gaseous acid released, you will accelerate the rusting/destruction of the knives. Any other knives in there with them will also be affected (the exception being some stainless steels are not quickly affected).


I found a good source for desiccant bags at a local Surplus Store. They sold 1-gallon Ziploc bags full of the desiccant packs for 3 or 4 dollars. I also keep expensive new belts for my knife grinders in Ziploc bags with the desiccant packs. It prevents them from breaking down due to the humidity.


This is a link to one of the best articles on celluloid I know. See if that doesn’t describe the problem you are observing. http://www.oregonknifeclub.org/celluloid_02.html


As a knife repairman and collector of knives, I will not own celluloid handled Fightin’ Rooster or Bull Dog knives. I have seen too many cases where those brands, though the knives were relatively new knives, they had off gassed with disastrous results to the knife itself and other knives nearby.

[whitebuffalo58]

Just my opinion, but you don't want to store those celluloid knives in a sealed enviroment or anywhere near your other knives. The off gassing will absolutely destroy anything within range of the vapors. Even HC stainless will take a hit from that stuff. Part of your problem may even be coming from storing them in the knife rolls. Your best bet with celluloid is open shelf display or at very least a large curio type cabinet with lots of air space. Even then, I'd cut or drill vent holes (one on top and one on bottom) to allow air to circulate. I love celluloid handles, but they do require special attention and can do irrepairable damage to a knife collection.

[whitebuffalo58]

Sorry Orvet, didn't mean to repeat almost exactly what you posted ahead of me. Sounds like we're of the same opinion though.

[tjmurphy]

Here are a couple of examples of Out-gassing that I posted a while back:

hsb out gassing2.jpg (25.04 KiB) Viewed 1141 times

hsb out gassing.jpg (37.47 KiB) Viewed 1141 times

[PA Knives]

I am not a chemist, but I find it interesting that the when they gas like that, it seems to affect the exposed blade the most. Does the brass liner protect it in some manner? Maybe there's something to that and it could be formulated to help protect our knives from this monster?

Everyone I have seen is just about the same. Rust on the exposed top of the blade. Didn't matter if the knife was stored on its side or upside down.

Just and observation.