The real deal or a reproduction?

[Ittsukan]

I usually collect pocket knives and the odd bayonet but recently stumbled upon a deal on some vintage fixed blades at a price I couldn't turn down.
This Ka-Bar was in the lot. Everything seems to point to it being WWII era but I want to be sure. I've searched through the forums and various sites on the intertubes but I'd like to get your opinions.
- The pommel is square/peened
- The pommel is 3/8" thick
- No black spacers, or red ones either, sadly
- No branch markings on the guard or ricasso
- Only KA-Bar on the ricasso as seen in the photos
- No branch marks on the sheath
- Sheath is marked BOYT -43-
- Sheath is stitched and reinforced with 9 staples
- Staples, snap and rivet holding the closure strap appear to be brass as there is evidence of verdigris

I'm fairly certain it isn't a reproduction. What do you all think?

[rea1eye]

I don't know enough to tell you if this is fake but congrats on the
photography. Everything clean and clear. This should help those
that are in the know.

Bob

[treefarmer]

If this knife is a reproduction, someone did a great job "patinaizing" it!
My opinion is based only on looks only, I know nothing about that Knife's construction, pommel attachment, etc.
Treefarmer

[1967redrider]

You might want to post it here as well-

viewtopic.php?t=56061

[Ittsukan]

Thanks. I'm not thinking of someone deliberately making a fake. I'm thinking of those knives that were made in the 1970's when Ka-Bar reintroduced this model. Those knives are 50 years old now and could easily look 80 years old if they lived a life.
I think there's some up on that auction selling site right now that are said to be WWII era but are really 1970's reproductions that look old. It's all in the construction and maybe details that others more knowledgeable than I may know about.

[Ittsukan]

You might want to post it here as well-

viewtopic.php?t=56061

Thanks. Good idea

[eveled]

It’s not only real, it’s in great shape. The sheath is also the correct one and in great shape.

[Ittsukan]

It’s not only real, it’s in great shape. The sheath is also the correct one and in great shape.

So, real WWII era? Probably made in 43 or 44?
I wonder how this US military knife got to Canada?

[Mumbleypeg]

I don’t know anything about it except that I like it. There is a wealth of information and pictures in this same KABAR Knife Collector’s Forum (where you posted this) including an entire thread about how to tell an authentic one, including the ricasso stamp description, pommel and peening of the pommel. See here viewtopic.php?t=56061. From the info there you can possibly verify (or not) yours, and probably learn something about it in the process.

Hope that helps. Some of the resident experts who wrote that thread will eventually see your post and comment.

Ken

[Ittsukan]

I don’t know anything about it except that I like it. There is a wealth of information and pictures in this same KABAR Knife Collector’s Forum (where you posted this) including an entire thread about how to tell an authentic one, including the ricasso stamp description, pommel and peening of the pommel. See here viewtopic.php?t=56061

Hope that helps. Some of the resident experts who wrote that thread will eventually see your post and comment.

Ken

Thank you. I posted to that thread as well

[eveled]

It’s not only real, it’s in great shape. The sheath is also the correct one and in great shape.

So, real WWII era? Probably made in 43 or 44?
I wonder how this US military knife got to Canada?

Yes, yes, no idea, but stranger things have happened.

[Ittsukan]

Just heard back from Ka-Bar and they confirmed it is WWII era made by Ka-Bar 1943 or early 1944 Considered a fighting/utility as it wasn't designated to a particular branch.
Still would like to hear your opinions though, especially in care and feeding.

[eveled]

Funny because what little knowledge KA-BAR has of their own history they learned from members here. They are not the authority on their own history.

Oil the blade, leather treatment is always a hot topic. So many variables in how the leather was originally tanned, so many products, so many opinions

I personally used bag balm sparingly on leather. But like anything else use at your own risk.

[Mumbleypeg]

I agree, anything a current-day employee or company paid “historian” tells you I’d take with a grain of salt and a spoonful of skepticism. Not their fault - I suspect they’re doing their best with what they have to work with. Cutleries notoriously kept poor records (who knew at the time there would some day be knife collectors obsessing over minutia)? The company, if still in business today has likely gone through several ownership changes and relocations. Company records and archives probably poor to begin with, have been destroyed, sold in bankruptcy liquidations, lost to fires, and so on.

The knives and associated artifacts themselves were made by workers the age of the current day historians’ great grandfathers. There are collectors today who have spent decades studying old knives, old cutlery catalogs, advertisements, etc, very little or any of which the cutleries themselves retained. Therefore those collectors are typically far more knowledgeable than any company historian. For example I’ve seen knives, claimed to have been authenticated by a company, that were obvious counterfeits. So take what KABAR told you as an input that may be right, or wrong. There are some authorities who are members here that I’d consider more reliable. JMO

As for “care and feeding” those are two of the most commonly asked questions here, especially by new members. You can find literally hundreds of posts here with opinions about both, simply by doing a “search” for keywords like “cleaning”, “protectant”, and “lube”. “Search” is found in the drop-down menu under Quicklinks on the upper left of this thread. Here are just a couple of example threads viewtopic.php?t=79594
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=54157

Ken

[Ittsukan]

I agree, anything a current-day employee or company paid “historian” tells you I’d take with a grain of salt and a spoonful of skepticism. Not their fault - I suspect they’re doing their best with what they have to work with. Cutleries notoriously kept poor records (who knew at the time there would some day be knife collectors obsessing over minutia)? The company, if still in business today has likely gone through several ownership changes and relocations. Company records and archives probably poor to begin with, have been destroyed, sold in bankruptcy liquidations, lost to fires, and so on.

The knives and associated artifacts themselves were made by workers the age of the current day historians’ great grandfathers. There are collectors today who have spent decades studying old knives, old cutlery catalogs, advertisements, etc, very little or any of which the cutleries themselves retained. Therefore those collectors are typically far more knowledgeable than any company historian. For example I’ve seen knives, claimed to have been authenticated by a company, that were obvious counterfeits. So take what KABAR told you as an input that may be right, or wrong. There are some authorities who are members here that I’d consider more reliable. JMO

As for “care and feeding” those are two of the most commonly asked questions here, especially by new members. You can find literally hundreds of posts here with opinions about both, simply by doing a “search” for keywords like “cleaning”, “protectant”, and “lube”. “Search” is found in the drop-down menu under Quicklinks on the upper left of this thread. Here are just a couple of example threads viewtopic.php?t=79594
viewtopic.php?f=37&t=54157

Ken

Thanks for the input. I completely agree. These companies were in the business of making knives, not keeping records. I contacted them simply as another resource. I've seen much better information shared here and on other sites than they were able to give. I'm interested in getting as many opinions as possible on this knife and welcome any and all to comment.
I simply haven't had time to go through all the threads on care and feeding. I really appreciate you sharing those links. I will check them out.