Knife Myths

coinshooter · Post by **coinshooter** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:14 am

Does anyone know if "peppers" on steel blades are from the effect of "long-term out-gassing" by plastic type handles under sealed conditions?
Does anyone know if "out-gassing" really occurs and is the cause of "peppers"?
Does anyone know the correct term used to describe peppers that have grown together and become a really ugly spot?
Any help to an amateur Yank will be much appreciated"

Classic Case · Post by **Classic Case** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:31 am

if the peppers are generally on the part of the blade exposed above the frame, and the handles are celluloid, chances are that is the cause.usually the shield and bolsters will tarnish as well, they just clean up easier,so they arent noticed as much after cleaning.store celluloid knives away from your other knives, even other celluloids,cause they can take them down with them.

gmusic · Post by **gmusic** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:55 am

Well!

"Pepper spots" on steel in my opinion are small rust spots; left unchecked will grow to become large rust areas! Look at them with a ten power loupe, very interesting stuff!
Rust literally eats away the surface of the steel, so to remove it means polishing deeper than the rust has eaten. Not good!

You can have pepper spots on nickle silver, it's simply tarnish, cleans up easily.

The term means different things to different people. Kind of like "mint."

Gassing does happen! Celluloid materials can corrode the steel. Are corrosion and rust one in the same? I'm not a metallurgist, but the end result in either case is bad news.

Hope this helped.

Gary

Hukk · Post by **Hukk** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 5:57 pm

RUST, also known as Ferric Oxide, Hematite, and red iron oxide. Red Jewlers rouge is very fine particles of ferric oxide with a wax/grease binder. Ferrous Oxide is black or iron (different than Ferric Oxide). Rust is a general term for iron oxides formed by the REACTION of iron with oxygen.

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:12 pm

Hukk wrote:RUST, also known as Ferric Oxide, Hematite, and red iron oxide. Red Jewlers rouge is very fine particles of ferric oxide with a wax/grease binder. Ferrous Oxide is black or iron (different than Ferric Oxide). Rust is a general term for iron oxides formed by the REACTION of iron with oxygen.

I'm going to start using some of these terms when describing my rusty old knives on eBay

. Might make 'em sound better.

...actually, might make them sound worse on second thought

"...the blades on this knife are aflicted with a slight case of hematitus..."

Bryan

lenny357 · Post by **lenny357** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 6:49 pm

OUT GAS ??? again has me worried I have a few Corelon type Case knives should these be stored away from my other knives are they subject to this out gassing????

Hukk · Post by **Hukk** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:02 pm

lenny357 wrote:OUT GAS ??? again has me worried I have a few Corelon type Case knives should these be stored away from my other knives are they subject to this out gassing????

It's not known to outgas from what I hear. Celluloid is or was nitro-cellulose and the gas could be a form of nitric acid. Just a guess, I would have to read the chemical composition.

Ah yes, Chemistry, Physics, and Metallurgy (material sciences for that matter) are great to read if you have insomnia, sleep in 5 minutes every time.

Hukk · Post by **Hukk** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:20 pm

Bryan wrote:
I'm going to start using some of these terms when describing my rusty old knives on eBay . Might make 'em sound better.

...actually, might make them sound worse on second thought

"...the blades on this knife are aflicted with a slight case of hematitus..."

Bryan

That reminds me of a study that was done by one of the colleges back east. They made a petition to ban a compound called Double H O because it killed thousands of people every year. Almost 100% of people signed this ficticious petition without bothering to ask what Double H O was. The real purpose of the study was to see how many people would blindly sign this petition.

Pretty amazing that so many people wanted to ban Double H O without bothering to ask what it was. Double H O could also be put as H2O or water. Yes, almost all people wanted to ban water. The study used drowning statistics worldwide (aproximate).

Yeah, we elect our officials pretty much the same way.

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:49 pm

Here's a nice article on gassing..

http://www.vintageknives.com/tek9.asp?id=29&pg=blank

Hukk · Post by **Hukk** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 11:51 pm

Here's one on just celluloid. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celluloid

It's somewhat related to EXPLOSIVES.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nitrocellulose

lenny357 · Post by **lenny357** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:12 am

So what I'm getting is that these new case knives are safe because it's no longer used??? Correct? I truelly prefer natural materials over all plastics or man made stuff. It seems there was a PLASTIC craze in the 50 and 60's correct? I just missed being born in the 60's

Hukk · Post by **Hukk** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:53 am

lenny357 wrote:So what I'm getting is that these new case knives are safe because it's no longer used??? Correct? I truelly prefer natural materials over all plastics or man made stuff. It seems there was a PLASTIC craze in the 50 and 60's correct? I just missed being born in the 60's

Corelon, Delrin, and a couple others are stable. Celluloid handles date back to the 1800's and they could be dangerous to make but once made, there is no guarantee on their stability. I imagine that they would burn well.

upnorth · Post by **upnorth** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 1:02 am

MOST delrin is stable, however, I have had two delrin handles go bad on me!
Unfortunately, one on each of two knives. They kept exuding a white "haze" on the surface that would not quite clean away, and they "puckered" as they shrank. I wonder if they weren't actually Celluloid dyed the same color as delrin? Both were 70's Case knives.