Case Bros. Cut. Co. Tortoise Shell

[PCwizard]

This little guy is up for sale on EBay right now, anyone know anything about it.

I'm not seeing that tang stamp on Case's tang stamp list on there website. They had a remake using that stamp in 2010, but this knife is way older than that unless its a fake. Haven't found any info on that pattern either, The seller is dating it around 1900-1914.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Case-Br ... 1955880453

.

[btrwtr]

I believe the knife is exactly what the seller says it is.

[msteele6]

The stamp is shown in Witcher's book on Counterfeiting (as a genuine stamping) on page 111.

Witcher gives a date of 1900 - 1912.

[PCwizard]

Wow, Thanks

[RobesonsRme.com]

And given the imperfection of that long pull, that's a forged blade.

Charlie Noyes

[stockman]

I have a little pearl handled knife with that same stamp.

Harold

[zp4ja]

I have a little pearl handled knife with that same stamp.

Harold

Me too.

[danno50]

Sargent's 7th edition has a pic of one very similar on page 41. He lists it as 2 1/2". The tang is too worn too see on the photo in the book. The one in Sargent's also had Tested XX stamped on the blade and no lanyard hole.
Dan

[sawgrass]

I am the person that has listed this knife. It is not counterfeit. This knife came from Tony Foster and he has evaluated the knife before selling the knife to me. Tony Foster knows as much about counterfeiting as anyone alive and especially with Case knives. I would never intentionally offer for sale any knife that was counterfeit or if altered, that would be disclosed. There is no Pattern number on the knife, but that is common. It is inexpensive because it is a small tortoise knife. Rest assured that this knife has been determined to be an honest knife. Thank you.

[sawgrass]

As can be seen in Sargent's Book, many of the Case Brothers knives had XX or Tested XX on the Blades or on the Tang, but many did not. Many of the Early Case Brothers knives were made by other companies for them. I do know a bit about Case Brother's knifes because I collect them and it offends me to have someone make an accusation or insinuation of Counterfeiting. I have never before had anyone insinuate that I would sell a counterfeit knife either by being unaware or intentional. That is offensive to me because I am very careful to not ever let that happen. The long pull is a tiny bit different because my knife has not been cleaned and the one in Sargent's book has been heavily cleaned. If anyone has a question or comment or feels that this is not a correct knife, it would have been better to have contacted me and checked things out before finding me guilty of fraud on this forum.

[peanut740]

Who said it was counterfeit?

[gsmith7158]

As can be seen in Sargent's Book, many of the Case Brothers knives had XX or Tested XX on the Blades or on the Tang, but many did not. Many of the Early Case Brothers knives were made by other companies for them. I do know a bit about Case Brother's knifes because I collect them and it offends me to have someone make an accusation or insinuation of Counterfeiting. I have never before had anyone insinuate that I would sell a counterfeit knife either by being unaware or intentional. That is offensive to me because I am very careful to not ever let that happen. The long pull is a tiny bit different because my knife has not been cleaned and the one in Sargent's book has been heavily cleaned. If anyone has a question or comment or feels that this is not a correct knife, it would have been better to have contacted me and checked things out before finding me guilty of fraud on this forum.

Sawgrass some of the folks on this forum use it as a sounding board to confirm things they don't know about. We trust our knowledgeable members here which is something I can't say about all ebay sellers. No one is accusing you of being dishonest, we are just comforting ourselves.

[Old Folder]

This little guy is up for sale on EBay right now, anyone know anything about it.

I'm not seeing that tang stamp on Case's tang stamp list on there website. They had a remake using that stamp in 2010, but this knife is way older than that unless its a fake. Haven't found any info on that pattern either, The seller is dating it around 1900-1914.


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Case-Br ... 1955880453

.

Hey Gary;
I have many older Case knives, but by far I am not a "Case Cutlery Pro"
Most of the confusion and questions of the above mentioned knife could have been resolved if we had better current documentation of not only Case Cutlery, but many of the knives we look for.
I do not know why most current books (And some older Case Reference books) do not show the "Older" Case blade tang stampings, especially Case's own website seems to ignore them. What's with that?
There are over fifty variations of Case markings. Mister Swayne's book (Pic's Below) states that the Tank Stamp in question you refer to is dated between 1896-1900 and not 1900-1914. But....Many other references for this Tang Stamp date it between 1900-1914.
Case knives, being the most collected, most researched, most popular and in demand cutlery in the world, you would think that ALL known tang stamps would be listed in reference books or at least current research books and documentations. But...they are not.
I hope the below reference book by: "Allen P. Swayne" dated 1987 by: "Knife World Publications" Titled: "The Case Knife Story" ISBN 0-940362-13-9 is of some assistance, and not confusion.
There are many "Case" pro's here on AAPK, perhaps you will share your "Older Tang Stamp" knowledge.
My knife on the first picture below has the same Tang Stamping.

[Old Folder]

I was fortunate enough to obtain the below Case knife in May 1993. It is my oldest and most prized Case knife and has the same Case stamp as the above knife in conversation.
The tang is stamped: (Case Bros. Cut. Co.) Many historians would date that this knife was made between 1900-1914. But....Allen P. Swayne's book, (Mentioned in my above post) would date this knife to be between 1896-1900.

[gsmith7158]

Old Folder that is some excellent information! Thank you for posting it.

[RalphAlsip]

Old Folder, beautiful knife and rare stamp - very nice

With regard to the original post knife, it looks good to me. I didn't see where anyone was explicitly questioning authenticity. In fact, it seems to me that most of the comments are implicitly supporting that the knife is good. However, the English language is full of words with multiple and ambiguous meanings that are easily miscommunicated and misinterpreted.

For example, the word "forged" was used in one of the comments describing the long pull and the blade. The word forge has multiple meanings:

1. to make or imitate falsely especially with intent to defraud : counterfeit <forge a document> <forge a signature>
2. to form metal by various processes such as heating, hammering, or mechanical means

When I read the comment, I interpreted the comment as support for authenticity because I thought the comment was talking about the use of knife making techniques during the era that the tang stamping is from. In other words I interpreted the comment according to definition #2 in my list above.

I can understand how someone could also interpret the "forged" comment according to definition #1. For example, the comment could be interpreted to state that the blade was forged like a check might be forged in committing the crime forgery.

[btrwtr]

Sawgrass no one here accused anyone of anything. Charlie's reference to a forged blade meant and early blade that was hand forged confirming the knife's age, not to mean the blade is a forgery. Forged not forgery.

Your knife was judged authentic and your input only helps confirm that.

Not all eBay sellers are honest. Some sellers unintentionally post bad knives and some deliberately post them as their normal business. To ask a seller if the knife they claim to be genuine is genuine or not can be a worthless attempt. Here at AAPK you can get unbiased opinions for what they are worth. I've seen knives posted in the counterfeit forum that were judged to be 100% correct. I've also seen knives that were posted in other forums that were judged to be anything but correct.

Please take no offense as none was ever intended. You are selling some very nice knives on eBay and this OP knife is just one of them.

[Old Folder]

Old Folder that is some excellent information! Thank you for posting it.

Your very welcome Greg.

And thank you "RalphAlsip"
If any of my knives could talk, this one would be at the top.

[sawgrass]

Thank you everyone. I am sorry to have come on strong. I felt accused and perhaps that wasn't the case. At any rate, thanks for your comments and please accept my apologies for my reaction. This is a good site with good knife people.

[PCwizard]

I was fortunate enough to obtain the below Case knife in May 1993. It is my oldest and most prized Case knife and has the same Case stamp as the above knife in conversation.
The tang is stamped: (Case Bros. Cut. Co.) Many historians would date that this knife was made between 1900-1914. But....Allen P. Swayne's book, (Mentioned in my above post) would date this knife to be between 1896-1900.

Old Folder
That is a wonderful knife you have there, I would not have guessed it was before 1900. Its in great shape thanks for sharing it.

[Old Folder]

I was fortunate enough to obtain the below Case knife in May 1993. It is my oldest and most prized Case knife and has the same Case stamp as the above knife in conversation.
The tang is stamped: (Case Bros. Cut. Co.) Many historians would date that this knife was made between 1900-1914. But....Allen P. Swayne's book, (Mentioned in my above post) would date this knife to be between 1896-1900.

Old Folder
That is a wonderful knife you have there, I would not have guessed it was before 1900. Its in great shape thanks for sharing it.

Your welcome Gary.
Even with the conflicting date, when I'm that age, I certainly won't have any "Walk & Talk"

[kootenay joe]

Mr. Davies (sawgrass) i do not understand your negative reaction to this thread and to AAPK.
Ebay knives are a great source for learning about knives. We post an ebay knife that is new to us in the hopes that another member can give us some accurate information about the knife. i.e. it is about the knife, not the seller, except for sellers who repeatedly list fake knives that they know are fakes but there was no suggestion that you are one of these dishonest sellers.
You could become a regular contributor here and share what you know about old Case knives and on occasion learn something that you did not already know.
AAPK has many sincere friendly and knowledgeable members. We could all benefit from you joining us.
kj

[gsmith7158]

Well it's a pretty nice knife. If nobody else wants it I'm gonna buy it. Speak now or forever hold your peace!

[gsmith7158]

Too Late it's gone!

[Tsar Bomba]

I take it that listing was B.I.N.? At that price I would have been interested for sure. The only thing that gives me pause is the lanyard/bail hole. I know a lot of older knives had small bails on them, but I don't often see them on these smaller swell-end jacks.

Posting in AAPK about our questions or our lack of knowledge is done solely with the intent to fill in those gaps and strengthen our knowledge of our cutlery. I think I see nearly as many genuine knives in the "Is this real?" threads as I do fakes, which is why I like reading those threads so much -- so much to learn, so many ways to enhance one's ability to 'read the knife'.

Also I endeavor to point out that this was posted in G.K.D. and not Counterfeit Watch, so I agree that there was no intent whatsoever of accusing
We question and study and learn here, so unless someone is knowingly purveying fakes (and those sellers already know who they are! ) there's never any reason to feel like one's integrity is attacked. We're all learning about the hobby together here.

sawgrass, I take it that beauty is genuine tortoise shell? It's a real nice piece of history, I'm glad you were able to pass it along.