Surf Fishing

[Steve Warden]

Sounds like you're trying too hard.
You mention it, it's about timing. When it's right, the flex in your rod will shoot the lure and line out for you. That's why it works with a fly rod and a lure the weight of a mosquito.
I'd rig up your rod with what you typically use, mash the hook flat, get out in the backyard and practice.

I agree, but i have already suggested, go and buy some casting plugs of different weights to practice your casting. And it is all about the timing and going through with one movement. You should not be flicking or whipping the rod tip, it should be a follow through one motion and let the rod do all the work.

I was going to suggest practice plugs, but using the gear you already have, and making it safe by mashing the hook, or no hook at all, is cheaper.

[cudgee]

Sounds like you're trying too hard.
You mention it, it's about timing. When it's right, the flex in your rod will shoot the lure and line out for you. That's why it works with a fly rod and a lure the weight of a mosquito.
I'd rig up your rod with what you typically use, mash the hook flat, get out in the backyard and practice.

I agree, but i have already suggested, go and buy some casting plugs of different weights to practice your casting. And it is all about the timing and going through with one movement. You should not be flicking or whipping the rod tip, it should be a follow through one motion and let the rod do all the work.

I was going to suggest practice plugs, but using the gear you already have, and making it safe by mashing the hook, or no hook at all, is cheaper.

You are quiet correct, but casting plugs are a lot easier to change the weights around, and most importantly, a lot easier to retrieve from tree branches.

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

Gentlemen - first thank you for the suggestions. I do have a bit of a problem with practice casting... I live in California, near the beach. That means I essentially have no yard. The house is just a bit smaller than the lot! The only place I could practice is at the beach, and if I'm going to walk to the beach with my rod, I might as well be fishing!

So, that's essentially what today was, I wasn't really trying to catch fish, I was just casting. The mistake I made was using an actual lure. What I should have done was just put a .75 oz or 1 oz weight on without a hook. But, I still would have gone swimming for the end of my rod.

And, just to prove I'm not exaggerating, here's a pic showing the situation:

Treefarmer - you are going to be disappointed in my knife selection. I stole the cheapest Dollar Store paring knife from the back of my wife's kitchen knife drawer and have made that into my "fishing knife". It's only redeeming quality is that it has a plastic sheath so I reduce the chance of cutting myself when I'm rummaging around in the Home Depot bucket I'm using as a tackle box...

[cudgee]

Gentlemen - first thank you for the suggestions. I do have a bit of a problem with practice casting... I live in California, near the beach. That means I essentially have no yard. The house is just a bit smaller than the lot! The only place I could practice is at the beach, and if I'm going to walk to the beach with my rod, I might as well be fishing!

So, that's essentially what today was, I wasn't really trying to catch fish, I was just casting. The mistake I made was using an actual lure. What I should have done was just put a .75 oz or 1 oz weight on without a hook. But, I still would have gone swimming for the end of my rod.

And, just to prove I'm not exaggerating, here's a pic showing the situation:

2020-08-18_201101.png


Treefarmer - you are going to be disappointed in my knife selection. I stole the cheapest Dollar Store paring knife from the back of my wife's kitchen knife drawer and have made that into my "fishing knife". It's only redeeming quality is that it has a plastic sheath so I reduce the chance of cutting myself when I'm rummaging around in the Home Depot bucket I'm using as a tackle box...

There's your answer. Rig the end of your line with a clip so you can change sinker size and weight, and practice in the surf.

[Eustace]

Well, I narrowly avoided a disaster today...

For the last couple of days, our surf has been unusually mild. So, I decided this would be a perfect time to try casting a hard bait lure that some people swear by. The minnow jerk bait is a little light for my rod, it weighs 7/8 oz, and my rod is a medium-heavy, rated 1 oz - 3 oz. But, the real handicap is that I suck at casting - hence why I wanted to get some time with it.

So, now the big question: What the heck am I doing wrong that my cast makes the rod come apart? What do I need to change to keep this from happening again?

At the risk of repeating myself - you try to use a fishing rod, which according to your description is more suitable for a tomato pole. This rod is not suitable for any of the fishing methods you describe. For your surf fishing, get a 12-14 ft surf casting rod. For fishing with lures from the beach, take 9-10 ft spinning rod with test 10-30 gr (or analogue in oz) . More than that is not necessary, unless you use heavy jigs. I would also advise you to remove the braid and get a quality monofilament. 0.28 - 0.30 mm for surf fishing and 0.18 - 0.20 - 0.22 for lure fishing.

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

I agree! It is actually worse than I thought because the lure I was trying to use on my rod rated for 1 oz min was only 5/8 oz. I'm currently shopping for a 9-10 ft salmon/steelhead rod that is rated to a max of 3/4 or 1 oz.

As usual, my answer to all problems is to throw many at the problem...

I was thinking about something like this one, which is 9 ft, medium power, medium fast action, 8-14 lb line, 3/8 oz-3/4 oz lure : https://www.uglystik.com/uglystik-rods- ... l#start=11

Or this one, which is similar in 9.5 ft:
https://www.fishusa.com/Shimano-Clarus- ... RiEALw_wcB

[Jeffinn]

So, now the big question: What the heck am I doing wrong that my cast makes the rod come apart? What do I need to change to keep this from happening again?

Those two rod sections should stay together even if you’re whipping it around. The fit between those two sections should be a fairly snug interference fit. I’ve seen a few rods where the fit between sections was too loose.
We do a lot of shore fishing here and we only occasionally have a rod section fly off usually because we didn’t put them together tightly to begin with (we usually use a slight twisting motion when putting them together).
And as others have said, timing when casting is everything! We fish with 3” artificial worms, no weight and rigged Texas style to prevent snags. And it’s surprising how far we can cast those little lures.
Like all things, practice make perfect! As long as you have some fun it’ll all come together for you.

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

Those two rod sections should stay together even if you’re whipping it around. The fit between those two sections should be a fairly snug interference fit. I’ve seen a few rods where the fit between sections was too loose.
We do a lot of shore fishing here and we only occasionally have a rod section fly off usually because we didn’t put them together tightly to begin with (we usually use a slight twisting motion when putting them together).
And as others have said, timing when casting is everything! We fish with 3” artificial worms, no weight and rigged Texas style to prevent snags. And it’s surprising how far we can cast those little lures.
Like all things, practice make perfect! As long as you have some fun it’ll all come together for you.

Yes! I saw a youtube video talking about the twist when putting them together, and I'm not sure I did that to my rod. It is also certainly possible it came a bit loose when I was messing around with putting on the hard bait, or pulling seaweed off of it after a retrieve, or something, and I didn't see it was loose.

My local tackle shop, which has been run by a very nice Vietnamese family for decades, has a Daiwa Acculite 9 1/2 ft salmon/steelhead rod for $65. It's cheaper online, but I haven't found it cheaper AND in stock. I'm also a bit worried about having a rod damaged in shipment and then needing to deal with a return - that pain in the rear would wipe out any $15 savings real fast. Plus, I don't mind giving the local store some business - they are always nice to me when I go in there and buy $3 worth of swivels. That's one of my tests for local retailers - if you are nice to me when I'm buying some small, trivial item, then I'm MUCH more willing to go back to you when I need to spend more significant money. But if you are nasty to me when I spend $3, then you can pretty much kiss any serious sales to me goodbye and I'll go online just so I don't have to give you my business!

[Steve Warden]

I like your business logic

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

Today was a good day for BOTH me and the fish. I didn't catch anything - not even a bite at 3 different locations. HOWEVER, I think I figured out one of the big things I was doing wrong with my casts. When I brought the rod back, the reel wasn't in the right orientation, and it was forcing me to twist the rod as I moved forward to release. When I made sure the reel was oriented properly, I suddenly started getting nearly twice the distance. I was casting farther than I have ever managed it in my life. And, I think this might have also contributed to the issue I had with the end of the rod coming apart. I think rolling the rod as I brought it forward may have caused the line to catch on the tip, which over time may have caused the top half to work loose.

I was all by myself on the fishing dock, with no wind and glassy water, so I could make cast after cast and it was much better! I was also able to put on a variety of different size weights and lures and cast with each of them. It was VERY satisfying!!

Unfortunately, while I was baiting my rig before going out in the surf, I foolishly stuffed my fishing gloves into the pocket of my shorts, then I forgot to put them on. At some point the gloves must have dropped out of my pocket (the surf was VERY strong today), and I didn't realize it until I was leaving.
So, I guess Amazon will get a little more of my money to replace them.

All-in-all - a very good day, even without a bite!

[Steve Warden]

Great to hear about your discoveries, TF!

And some days it's just more about the fishin' than it is about catchin' fish!

[Jeffinn]

Great to hear about your discoveries, TF!

And some days it's just more about the fishin' than it is about catchin' fish!

Well said! It’s all about being outdoors and enjoying the day.
Jeff

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

Went out this morning about an hour before high tide. Yesterday afternoon the surf had turned angry and was a dirty brown with stormy waves and lots of broken seaweed. I tossed a few casts but I knew it was hopeless. All I caught was chopped salad. So, I went over to my backup spot at the dock in the harbor and caught this little dink. So, not a skunk! I threw my bait until my arm got tired and then I went home. A good morning!

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

After several days of skunks, including a 3 hour session yesterday with no catches AND no bites (a double skunk!), this morning was finally a good (for me) day! I got 3 dinky surf perch all this same size in 2 hours of fishing. The seaweed was terrible again at my beach, so I walked North and found a cleaner spot on the North side of a jetty. The first one (this guy) was on the first cast. The other two were a lot more effort, with several bumps and lost bait before finally hooking. As the tide came up, I expected a few more fish, but the rising tide also brought more seaweed and A LOT more turistas on the beach, so I packed-up and went home quite satisfied! Sorry for the lousy picture and tape management, it took me a while to dehook and I wanted a quick pic before I got him back home.

[LongBlade]

Good fun TFL .. That first fish you posted looks like a corbina but not sure as can't see the fins well and perhaps he's not fully matured at the size... I have some friends out in CA who fly fish the surf for Corbina and Surf Perch... farther north off the CA coast they target Stripers and Salmon... I've fly fished CA but on a boat 60 miles out off San Clemente Island (overnight trip) - lots of calico bass (great pull on those rock-loving bass - you can have a shot at those inshore near rocky jetties too - but we also halibut and bonito... we chased the yellowfin tuna running under the dolphin far offshore but they were more on the move and not feeding - and yes tuna on a fly rod ...

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

That previous fish is a White Croaker, sometimes also called a Tommy Croaker (not to be confused with a Tomcod). Corbina & Yellow Fin Croaker have a single barbel on their lower chin.

We get Corbina on our beach - I have seen a couple, but I have never caught one. In fact, I saw one just this morning. He was in the skinny water just as I came around the rocks of the jetty. He must have seen me, because he took off like a scalded cat back into the surf and I never saw him again. Sight fishing for Corbina is WAY over my skill level. Maybe someday...

We also get a pretty good number of halibut caught from shore here. I have only caught one very small halibut (half the size of a keeper), but there have been several keeper halibut caught from our beach this year, including one that was 30 inches.

I have never gone ocean boat fishing. I'm really not much of a boat guy, and being offshore in the big blue freaks me out a bit. I'm perfectly happy standing in water up to my knees and catch & releasing 6 inch dinks!

[Steve Warden]

Glad to hear you're having some success and enjoying yourself, TF!

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

After a good day yesterday, I figured today would be a bust, and it was - no bites at all. Last night I used a different method to tie up a couple of Carolina rigs, but on the very first cast I discovered a flaw and I had to spend some time switching to a different rig (a high-lo). I guess I will need to go back to my old method for the Carolina rigs, which sucks because it takes a lot longer to tie and is not as flexible. I'll have to ask some of the guys on the surf fishing forum for advice on that one.

There was a guy on the beach that had four poles in the water, and he looked like he was starting to pack-up to leave. I was just getting to this spot, so I asked him how he did. He said he did "great" and caught a "bat ray and a big ol' sand shark". He then said he was leaving and asked if I wanted his squid for bait. I said thank you and declined - and I was thinking "you caught a bat ray & a sand shark - two fish that love squid and that I definitely do NOT want to catch." Yeah, a catch is a catch, but rays & sharks are a pain in the arse - especially the rays. They have a nasty stinger at the base of their tail and they can whip that sucker around and nail you in the hand or leg while you are trying to get the hook out and release them. There are some guys that cut the stinger off before releasing them. I think that is just wrong. You caught it, and you need to either keep it, or release it unharmed back to the water. That's your responsibility as a fisherman.

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

I went out this morning for the first time with my new rod. I like it! However, that was the only good thing about my session...

I bought the new rod so that I could use the 5/8 oz Lucky Craft jerk bait that is very popular out here for surf fishing. So, I started with that rather expensive hard lure ($18!) and although the water looked fairly clean, I immediately had trouble with seaweed. Then, on only my 3rd or 4th cast, my line snapped and I lost the lure! ARRRRGGGHHH!!

I looked down at my reel because I though that maybe I had forgotten to open the bail, but NO, the bail was open. Apparently I screwed-up something else on the cast, and the line became caught in this little cutter/catch notch built-in to the side of the spool. The broken end of the line was sitting in this notch (this is a pic from the internet of the same reel I have):

2020-09-19_120200.png (152.62 KiB) Viewed 2790 times

Why the heck do I need a line cutter on the side of the spool of a lightweight spinning reel?? It's not like I'm going to need to quickly break-off my 120 lb line when I snag a 20 ft Great White!

So after that disaster, I tied on a Carolina rig and fished and walked up and down the beach looking for a less seaweed and some biting fish. I got neither. No bites, no fish and just enough seaweed to make it bloody annoying.

So, now I guess I will need to worry about one more thing on my casts. Maybe I can cover that notch with a piece of electrical tape or fill it in with some glue? This old reel is cheap and fairly crusty and I am eventually planning to replace it.

[Jeffinn]

I’ve never seen a cutter built into the reel like that. All of my reels have a little piece that you can wrap your line around when you’re done fishing to keep it from un-spooling (usually used for long term storage). But those little line holders are usually down low enough on the spool to prevent any issues. Open face reels are my favorites but they do have their idiosyncrasies.
Your most expensive lures will always be the ones you lose first. I think it’s some sort of Murphy’s law for fishing!
Jeff

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

I think you are right - I think it is not actually intended to be a line cutter, it is probably, as you suggested, a line keeper - BUT, it certainly seems to have acted like a very efficient cutter and lure ejection device!

We're transitioning from Summer fishing to Fall/Winter, and that means there *should* start to be an opportunity for striped seabass. In fact, I saw a striper in a guy's bucket on our beach yesterday. I doubt I have the skill & experience to go for those big boys. From what I have read, you have to be very good at reading the beach and knowing where they will be hunting, then you have to be able to place and work your bait. I'm not very good at any of those things!

One of the methods is too look for diving sea birds. The sea birds are diving on the same bait fish that the sea bass will be feeding on. I saw that happening just past the breakers yesterday, but then I saw that there was already another fisherman working on that spot - a seal! When you see a seal, the only thing you can do is find another spot to fish and hope the seal doesn't follow you.

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

You ever get the feeling that you are just catching the same fish over & over??

I have had about 4 sessions in a row where I have caught only 1 fish, all at the same spot and all about the same size. Tough going!

Saturday I went out just before the morning high tide. I had fished the same spot for almost an hour and was just about to give up and move when I got this little guy. Sorry for the sandy picture - the fish did a flip-flop just as I was about to take the picture and I didn't want to run him back and forth to the water. He was released unharmed. Camo Gulp sandworm on a Carolina rig. The water was very nice, small surf (so no surfers!) and not much seaweed in this spot.

I moved down the beach to near a jetty and immediately saw a big Corbina jumping inside the small breakers. He jumped at least 4 times over the next 20 minutes. I tried to get him to take my sandworm, but he wasn't interested. I felt a bump on my foot and looked down to see a little bat ray swimming around. He was tiny for a bat ray, probably no more than 12 inches across. I fished all along the beach from the jetty to the seawall for the next 2 hours. I might have gotten a couple of bumps, but nothing else.

Sunday I again went out just before the morning high tide to the same spot where I caught the little guy on Saturday. It was pretty much a repeat of the previous day. I had fished for about an hour and was just about to give up and try moving when I again caught another little guy.

Same setup, camo Gulp sandworm on a Carolina rig. The surf was higher today. I continued fishing around this spot for the next two hours with a couple of different softbaits but had no other action.

I really don't understand why I can only catch one fish per day. Clearly, there are fish in this spot. I don't know if I'm just not presenting the bait they want (I looked for but did not find any sandcrabs), or if I'm not able to place the bait where the school is, and I'm just getting a straggler that is away from the main school. I'm trying to fan cast and move laterally all around the spot, but before and after I catch the one fish, there is nothing!

The weather has been awesome, the water has been perfect and even though I'm not catching dozens of fish, I'm having a GREAT time!

[Old Folder]

Thanks' for the updates TFL
Perhaps it's the same fish, just going for the sandworm?
He knows you'll return him.
All I have ever caught here in Castaic is a cold.

[doglegg]

TFL do you think there is a fish telling his friends. 'I don't understand, this same guy keeps catching me.....'

[TwoFlowersLuggage]

I had a fun fishing session this morning. I went out at ~ 8 AM, which was on the falling tide (not the best time). It is an overcast day, about 65 deg F, and the water temp is just slightly warmer at 67 deg F. The surf was very mild, so I fished with a hard jerk bait for about an hour, but had no bites. I then switched to my old standby of a plastic sandworm on a Carolina rig and I immediately hooked-up on the biggest perch I have caught this year! It is still small by the local standards, but it was still a fun catch, a beautiful fish and a big improvement over what I've been seeing all year.

After that high, I had big hopes for more even bigger fish - but the only other fish I caught was the smallest perch I have EVER caught. A lifetime personal record for dinkiest perch! This guy was so small, that I honestly had no idea it was on my line until I reeled him all the way in to check my bait! He was barely bigger than the plastic sandworm. He looks like he should be in someone's 10 gallon fish tank, not the Pacific Ocean.

A fun morning, but if the water gets any colder I am going to need to think about getting some waders.