stag handles

[pwwright74]

Greetings,

Another question from a newby. I recently acquired two new Case pocket knives (never been used), one with a stag handle, one with bone stag. On both, and on some other stag knives I've seen, I have usually noticed a small fissure either on the front or back. On one, it originated from the jig pattern, which seems to look natural. Is this inherent in stag and/or bone, or is this considered a defect. Also, does this in any way detract from the overall value of the knife? Many thanks again for your help.

Paul

[smiling-knife]

Hi Paul,

Good question. As a natural material, genuine stag will have some fissures etc. This is different from a crack or split which obvioulsy should not be found on a new knife. Not sure what bone stag is exactly. There is second cut stag where the material is actual antler but may be a smooth peice with little character. This can be jigged like bone. Or bone can be jigged to give the impression of stag. Natural variations in material should not detract from the value. Cracks or damage obviously will. If you post a pic or two you will gets lots of opinions re you specific knives. s-k

[pwwright74]

Will post some pictures of my knives later, but here's a pic I found on the web that demonstrates the same kind of fissures I'm talking about (marked with an arrow). I assume since this knife is advertised as "new and unused" this should be a natural effect, but I don't know for sure. Many thanks for your imput.

[msteele6]

I don't know much about stag, but the handles shown in your picture look to me to have cracks. I think the acid test would be to see if you can feel them with your fingernail. If you can feel them, then in my opinion, they are cracks.
I'm not saying that any stag knife with a crack is junk, I think many valuable knives would still have pin cracks etc. but a crack is a crack.

[edgy46]

Bone stag or stagged bone are terms used to describe bone that is made to look like stag.These terms are at least one hundred years old. Hope this helps.PS if your name is Wright and you are interested in geneaology e mail me at [email protected].

[pwwright74]

I don't know much about stag, but the handles shown in your picture look to me to have cracks. I think the acid test would be to see if you can feel them with your fingernail. If you can feel them, then in my opinion, they are cracks.
I'm not saying that any stag knife with a crack is junk, I think many valuable knives would still have pin cracks etc. but a crack is a crack.

But the picture here if of a "new and unused" knife, advertised on eBay, and I have seen this on other new knives. So you think this is a defect, as opposed to natural? Would you still buy the knife if you saw this?

[muskrat man]

the crack pictured is natural occuring, not of fault to the cutler who assembled it, now if that crack were at a pin going to the edge of the bolster or edge of the handle then it would not sit so easy with me. Natural fissures are fairly common in sambar, especially in mammoth ivory. It seems the older it gets the more it fissures

[Forensic Jim]

I agree with Muskrat Man on this one. I've seen some of the best, gnarliest stag, that was over 30 years old that had fissures that ran from a deep groove in the stag to the bolster. Some knifers would not even consider it since they were convinced it was a crack and therefore a defect. I had one swingguard that had literally hundreds of fissures running all the way from one end of the scales to the other and was the same on both sides. I had one guy who took one look at the knife and said he had to have it. He wasn't blind either, just loved the character of the stag.

[Hukk]

the crack pictured is natural occuring, not of fault to the cutler who assembled it, now if that crack were at a pin going to the edge of the bolster or edge of the handle then it would not sit so easy with me. Natural fissures are fairly common in sambar, especially in mammoth ivory. It seems the older it gets the more it fissures

I agree about the stag and especially about the Mammoth Ivory. The more fissures there is on mammoth ivory, the more it seems to cost. Just check around, there are several sites to compare quality ivory. Alpha Knife is one of my favorite sites and they have some sets that are over $200.00 and an occasional one approaching $300.00. I have bought some there, very little for me though. I have gotten good deals on titanium and Sambar Stag.

Fissures are not cracks - they are more like character lines that add to the look of the materials such as stag, some bone (especially Giraffe and Camel) and mammoth ivory and do not generally grow into cracks. Cracks are damage and can grow bigger, though some will remain unchanged darn near forever.

[BIGHEAD]

Amen Kaleb. alot of people think that a natural fissure is a crack and a flaw.Not true I have hunted for many years and bagged my share of bucks with beautiful racks but they all have their flaws.the Example shown is nothing more than a natural; fissure in the horn.could it get worse? sure if it were not taken care of properly.

[msteele6]

I would just add this, and, of course it's only one man's opinion, but you should ask yourself this question. "Would I pay more for a knife like the one pictured if the fissures weren't there?"

If you answer the question "Yes", then for you, as a collector, it detracts and is a defect.

Of course the cracks (or euphemistically, fissures) are natural, but that still doesn't answer the more important question "Are they desirable?" And that is a question that can only be answered on a collector by collector basis.

My guess is that the majority of collectors would look at the knife shown and one EXACTLY like it, except without the fissures, and pick the one without the fissures and that (the collective preferences of all collectors), in my opinion, is the final say on the matter, because, after all, it is the collective preference of all collectors that determines the value of a collectible.

JMO

M. Steele