Western New York & Geneva Knife Co

[kootenay joe]

I would like some help with 2 interesting knives.
The first is a 2 5/8" shadow swell center pen knife marked: "Western/Cutlery Co/New York" on both blade tangs.
LG4 gives "Western Cutlery Co as an importer in New York 1874-1910 of knives from Germany & Austria.
As this knife has no country of origin, can i assume it is from before 1891 ?

The second knife is a 3 3/4" swell center whittler marked on all blades: "Geneva/Knife Co" with a Maltese Cross with K B in it on back tang of each blade.
I am showing it with a Cattaraugus because this is a similar frame.
The "KB" makes me think of Krusius Brothers but there is no "Germany" on the knife. It did come from a collection in Solingen so could be German made not for export ?
Please let me know what you think; Cattaraugus or German ? Or ??
kj

[peanut740]

Not Cattaraugus.

[kootenay joe]

Is there a specific feature that rules out Cattaraugus ?
kj

[knife7knut]

I would say they were both of German origin if only because of the little line under the O in Company. Strange that the pivot pins aren't steel(unless it isn't showing up in the picture).Not sure that the KB inside the Iron Cross is a Krusius Brothers stamp.Usually the ones I run across have the KB inside a beaded oval and it says,"KB Extra"
Whatever the case they are both nice knives.

[kootenay joe]

Visible pivot pins means almost certainly German construction.
Pivot pins not visible means could have been made in any one of a number of countries including Germany.
kj

[peanut740]

Is there a specific feature that rules out Cattaraugus ?
kj

The bolsters are longer on the KB knife.Catt most likely wouldn't make 2 patterns that close to the same size,shape etc.

[kootenay joe]

O.K., thanks for the explanation.
kj

[RobesonsRme.com]

I think both the knives are German.

But, the presence of that little line under the "O" in Co. nor steel pins in the bolsters is proof positive of that.

Suggestive, but not proof.

Charlie Noyes