New Switchblade Forum

[btrwtr]

Nick, Looks like you have a real quality collection going there. Very Nice!

[Nick]

Thank you friend, it has taken a while and one at a time as you know how expensive some of these can be. I look at it as a small investment. Well worth it, knives are so much a piece of history that you can hold in your hand, that is so cool to own one.

[wiseguy]

You guys have a great bunch of knives

[lt632ret]

I just noticed this new forum thread and knowing some of the people involved I wanted to help out if I could.( they have always been generous with help to me) Normally, I am kind of tied up with the knife museum ( see Wawarsing knife museum thread ) Hopefully we will finally be open this spring or summer. Naturally after all these years my health is breaking down just when we are finally ready to get it going anyway it is giving me some more time for other things. So my reason for this posting is if anyone has a specific vintage domestic automatic they would like to see there is a good chance I may have it and while home and able I would be happy to try to post some pics and if requested would try to answer whatever I could regarding these items. This includes Schrade, G Schrade, presto, press button, case, Ka-Bar , Challange, Korn, card knives ect I also have some old english french italian indian and while I do not have everything, if I do have a model of interest and can be of a positive help for those trying to get this going it would be my pleasure to do so. I also wanted to put something on which I have not posted before and these two have recently come into my possession. I really had a long search for these models of G Schrade apparently they were fairly rare
These are wormgroove bone presto hunters in the large Hunter and business size for you purists these have been cleaned however just finding them was tough enough so I did have the work done to bring them back to excellant cleaned condition. For those who know me, my addiction to these old knives,is well documented so any thread or interest in there study is welcome and appreciated. I may not have an odd ball contract of a specific knife such as those made under Press button under contract for other companies how ever I probably will have the same model or pattern under the Press button tang or at least one other company. What I am saying is that I am not playing lets try to stump LT Nor do I wish to seem like a show off. My only goal is to keep this history alive and to make people aware and able to access these beautiful artifacts of our cutlery history. if there is a model you have heard of and would like to see I will try to help if I can. If someone else can contribute to the subject or has an example please let us see it and tell us about it. LT

[wiseguy]

Firstly, Those 2 pictured are very nice , as a collector of Presto knives I can appreciate them very much . Thanks for offering up the time and resources to do this for us here I`d like to see some that has eluded me for years . PBKC 4'' ( Business ) with folding guard . and the Small PBCK "Florida Keys railroad extension completion model / motif . Thanks again . Oh , if you can show a small Korn`s without the guards would be great . , JJ

[Miller Bro's]

LT, those are two beautiful old knives never seen the worm groove bone on these before

I would like to see any knives you have that were made under the Wilzin patent

[lt632ret]

As you can see mechanical asst pen knives have been around for quite some time Wiltzen under 2 patents 400987 401093 since 1889 This pat was first used by the automatic knife company and then by Hatch. I am attaching some pics of a hatch frame, two hatchs ( one being a Columbus issue ) and a Wiltzen under Automatic knife. In 1898 Lever knife in Brooklyn had patent 616 689 which was a lever assist form of pen knife, While marked lever I believe these were made on contract by Napanoch after 3 years Lever folded. This same knife then was made and stamped by Napanoch knife. I am including pics of 2 lever and 2 napanoch versions. I have also included two pics of two old English pellet knives which were kind of a fore runner of these other assisted opening knives . There are other mechanical mech variations ring turns and a variety of others. However you asked about Wiltzen and I have already strayed to far. As with most of these topics you could do a book on it alone. I also noticed some reference to other mechanical mechs in earlier posts. LT

[lt632ret]

Well like I said I can only do the best I can. First regarding the PB business with guard. I am familiar with that knife I looked at it in Jerry Skeltons catalogue for years. I also spoke to him about it He would not claim it to be something they sold. In his ad in the catalogue he says may be prototype. I am not saying it is not factory it may very well have been a prototype, It would not be that tough to notch the handle and put a crossbar but again I do not know, his is the only one I have ever seen I have included a picture of it from his old catalogue. Look at the others with it. blade seems a bit down condition though is good like it might have been cleaned or worked on who knows except that is as close as I can get to sending you a picture of it. Jerry was a great guy and a true gentleman I truly miss him as a friend. In this picture he was asking 1500 for this knife and that was some years ago the ones around it were a few hundred. I have several press button catalogues I have never seen it listed and they did usually list even the rare stuff. I have included a price list from a 1903 catalogue. There was a question that used to come up if press button had ever made a sabre blade large hunter. I got asked it for years finally when I got this catalogue I saw it listed. ( In fact I have one ). Guardians made for only around 7 years are listed so my point is and I mentioned it to Jerry was that I had never seen a reference to it he said neither did he. Perhapes one of these days I will have a business grooved drilled add a cross bar and add it to the collection as a conversation piece. It could have very well been a proto or limited edition I do not know but have never seen another. I am interested in opinions especially if any one has any info on this. Next we have the Florida press button. No I do not have that piece in fact I only have a couple of those little commerative doubles. I did put a picture of a Florida PB commerative it is the St Augustine which is fairly common but again my aim is to show people who may not be that familiar with various companies and patterns an example. You obviously are not a newby and as such I would welcome any pics and help or information you might wish to contribute. Now to the last part of question regarding the KORN no I do not have that version I only know one person who might perhapes two any way I have to content myself with the one with a guard that I do have. of which I included a pic I recently had a chance to get another similar with gutta percha handles it was around 10,000 I pased on perhapes if my poker luck had been better that week I might have considered it. Again my goal is to at least have an example but no one can have it all. Unless I guess you hit the mega lotto. Sorry I could not give you the actual examples however this is pretty rare stuff and my intention is to try to be informative and hopefully a bit humorous. LT

[wiseguy]

Thanks, cool to see the ad , no mention of the spear 4'' model ?? . The blade on a regular Business or any large frame PBKC would be totally different from the folding guard model so adding a guard would be very obvious and not work . There is a hump on the guarded models to accommodate the threw pin on the guard . I have only seen one 4 incher with a hole for the guard but the guard was missing . here`s the Press button I was talking about

[wiseguy]

very interesting , some of those I have not seen

[lt632ret]

Check the ad 500 507 4 inch in spear. You are probably right on redoing a business with a guard I am not very adept at hands on however I know a couple of people who can do amazing stuff. Still it is interesting that you found a four inch with a hole validates this a bit. Nice PB I really like those commerative doubles but you do not find them to often and the price is usually out of sight. I had some opportunitys in the past but back then raising a family was more important. Thankyou for the pic. LT

[wiseguy]

Ah ,,,, I see now don`t know how I missed that . someday I`ll find that elusive little Pressbutton swinger nice Korn`s . EDIT ; I see this thread was moved to an existing one The deco PBCK knife I showed is not mine , those are from the auction site a few years ago . Has anyone seen a 5'' Presto derby guard( not the folding guard and not the 4''er ) with black wormgroove handles ? that's one hard to find ....... ???? Also since LT was so kind to offer up his time LOL I have seen ads for the CRAFTSMAN that depicts the LARGE frame swing guard ( with the red handles) but have only seen the small size one ......

[wiseguy]

[lt632ret]

Well once again I can only come close which is what I originally intended to try to do, small variations and various colors ect are almost impossible to have in every thing so as I originally said here are some as close as I have . This is the large derby bolster guard in brown brain ( wormgroove) and the smaller version in the later swirl brain. I have I believe seen the larger orange schrade cross guard which along with the small version was sold to sears when the military did not want this style. Henry Baer had a lot of ties with Sears and he also was affiliated with them I suppose somewhere down the road I should pass some of those stories down he was an amazing man and had alot of irons in the fire. Actually there were a few of the larger in other colors ( please do not ask me to prove it I cannot ). The vast majority however are the shorter with cross guard. I attached a pic of one I have ( the shorter one ) that is unused still with original etch blade uncleaned. Please if anyone has the exact requested item post it. All three of these should give the viewer an idea of the ones requested. Which is my goal. LT PS as an after thought to show an example I am adding a picture of a floating guard derby in the requested black brain ( wormgroove ). This might help any newer people to see what we are talking about.

[wiseguy]

Thanks for showing those LT . I like the small fixed guard model Presto . can you recall if Schrade cut co. made a spear blade on the single hunting / sportsman sized knives ? I thought I had maybe seen a 4.25'' with one but not on the larger frame knife . One with ebony handles .....That would be cool

[lt632ret]

Over the years one of the rules of thumb I always quote is that when dealing with schrade never be surprised at what may turn up. Schrade had in the last factory ( which had been the electronic company Channel Master ) what they called the R&D ( research and development) room and there were some amazing one of a kind knives made there. I Had heard about it for years and finally got in to it, after they closed when I was attempting to save whatever I could, by then it was pretty well empty. I have told that story, but suffice to say I did see it. It was there. It was where various employees would tinker with new ideas. I have a few of these items but mainly non automatics. Over the years some of those protos were produced and most were forgotten sometimes thrown away sometimes taken home . So you never know what could come up Schrade did not make these automatics in Ebony nor did they use spear blades on them but you never know what might turn up. The room was empty by the time I went in but I had always heard about it, nothing special work table and what you would expect.. But the reason I say it is because over the years I managed to get a couple of knives that were automatic and unusual attached is a pic of a fishtail. Notice it has no lock that knife came out of the R&D room the only way for me to confirm that, besides knowing who it came from and my word is the celluloid handle which is a unique cell that is identified with Schrade. This knife came with another fishtail which was bone handled with nickle bolsters with a spear blade which I no longer have . The reason I do not have it is because I was made an offer I could not refuse. I needed A union dogs head side lever ( as made on contract for Union (ie pre KA BAR ) by Ariel or Jaeger . Known as a 61126L for my book. Even then in 2001 they were very rare and expensive. The last i saw one for sale it was 5000 and that was years ago. I haven't seen one since. I could have borrowed one but all the knives in my book are mine. So a collegue of mine who had one was willing to part with it unfortunately besides a wad of money and some other goodies my spear proto fishtail also went. I still have the dogs head and have included a picture the blade is down a bit but otherwise it is a decent example of this knife. So you never know what may turn up. For years I had heard of a folding hunter with a TROOPER etch that was a special issue. Then one day I bought a collection and in it was a 4,1/4" folding hunter with an etch. The etch was a parachute with PARA TROOPER on it. I checked the catalogues and sure enough it was a civilian issue . Autos were still legal and to make this story even stranger in 1954 my father had the post barber shop at Stewart Air Force Base near Newburgh. So as an 8 year old kid I was on base alot I used to go to the px (where you could buy a Steak salad milk and desert for around a dollar ) Then I used to have a couple of nickles left for the old wood pinball machine that the airmen had put ashtrays under so that the ball would not go down . Then I would go over and look at the sporting goods especially the knives and Damn if I do not remember the little switch blade that I lusted for and could not buy which had a parachute on it ( I never remembered the words PARA TROOPER ) so when looking for the trooper knife I never put the two together. 1954 Korea was over and Schrade was switching to the Orange shroud knife. So they were marketing these this way. It is funny I am an old fart and cannot remember what I had for breakfast but knives ( pardon the pun ) stick with me. So I included a picture of this knife as well. Recently I saw the large hunter with this etch come up for sale so it apparently was used on both sizes. For years I looked for a knife made for NY state troopers so like I said you never know.

[wiseguy]

Love that dogshead , another member here posted one recently . A spear fishtail bowtie ? Wow , haven't seen that one . I have had the large frame with bail etched like yours with the parachute but it`s gone . Here`s one you should see LT .... rare handles as you know and "Commando " etch so ya , I guess you just never know .

[lt632ret]

Neato like I said mine needed attention when I got them . At least they are saved.

[wiseguy]

Ya , MM does wonders with them I would love to visit your Museum someday before I die are you going to the OKCA show ?

[lt632ret]

I do not know what show that is I pretty well stay out of the way. I only started posting because of a couple of people who have always been good folks, that and I have been home for a while I should be going to do a display at the museum tomorrow but I am not up to it. A little sun would help. LT

[Miller Bro's]

In 1898 Lever knife in Brooklyn had patent 616 689 which was a lever assist form of pen knife, While marked lever I believe these were made on contract by Napanoch after 3 years Lever folded. This same knife then was made and stamped by Napanoch knife. I am including pics of 2 lever and 2 napanoch versions. I have also included two pics of two old English pellet knives which were kind of a fore runner of these other assisted opening knives .

I always liked these type of knives, though when new they were not practical, harder to make, more expensive to buy, and in the end the plain old nail nick out lasted them all, these are still interesting to collect today.

The inventor was Ernst Ruettgers his patent is here https://www.google.com/patents/US616689 ... CDYQ6AEwAA

I agree, they were made by Napanoch.

[orvet]

I do not know what show that is I pretty well stay out of the way. I only started posting because of a couple of people who have always been good folks, that and I have been home for a while I should be going to do a display at the museum tomorrow but I am not up to it. A little sun would help. LT

OKCA is the Oregon Knife Collectors Association show in Eugene Oregon.
It is next month, April 12th & 13th.
Come on out to Oregon Lt I would love to see you at the show!
You never know what you will find at the OKCA show!

We have been having sunshine out here the last week or so, no guarantees on the weather though when the show gets here!

It is great to see you posting again Lt!
I have missed seeing your awesome knives!

[lt632ret]

Hey Dale no I won't be out, I am up to my whatever in alligators . The museum is just that close and I have lost some steam so that is what I hope to complete. Just rough timing it has been a brutal winter. Frankly not alot comes up that I really go after any more and in fact I have a lot of extra stuff. We have some amazing collections from other folks as well as mine and just so much space at the museum. Frankly what I could use is a guy who just hit the lottery to buy and preserve some of my groupings. I do not have alot of doubles but do have a pretty good representation of most of the companies. I will not mess with dealers I know most and the ones I know well, have said quite honestly that they usually go after bargains from widows or people needing money quick. It aint pretty but it is true I guess that is business. Luckily I am not in that position. I do not even like to dicker about money any more. That is why I do not like to do shows. I guess It is part of the game . Mainly I do not want to ( example) break up a complete set of press button hunters large and small by selling one piece out of it a complete set is one thing but a set missing say a guardian model is a different thing. It is no big deal either way. Actually if someone made me an offer chances are I would not sell anyway. I say I am not buying but actually a piece here apiece there some months I will spend a couple of grand. I just do not go after stuff with the same fierce attitude i used to. it is still less expensive than playing poker if my luck is running bad. I have cut back on Crown Royal and that is a saving. As far as chasing gals at 68 I have cut back on that as well ( damn shame) but it also saves money. I hope my sense of humor does not offend anyone. Enjoy the show I hope you are feeling better and able to do some knife work I know you enjoy it please say hello to your family for me. Stay well LT

[orvet]

Thank you Lt!
I am doing pretty well lately, just moving slowly. I had a new knee put in last April, just one week after the show.
I am now walking without a cane for the first time in more than 10 years! I still get worn out easily and have to pace myself, but I try to get 2 or 3 hours per day in the shop.
I will have to send you a picture of my latest customizing effort as soon as I get it polished. I took some pics and discovered scratches I couldn’t see even with my glasses.
I am only 62 but some days I think my eyes are 95!

Hey, I need to give you a call, been ages since we caught up.

Stay well my friend!
Dale

[wiseguy]

I have no complete sets of knives and if I did ,,,,, probably could not break a set up . check out the flylock I posted in "American switches" have you guys seen that etch on these ?