J.A. Henckels knives

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Wed Jan 25, 2006 10:49 pm

Hi everybody, I am a new member, have been reading and enjoying the forum and decided to drop in. I would like to hear some comments on the Henkels pocket knives. I recently purchased a Henckels medium sized whittler with nice stag handles. The baldes are tight and walk and talk. The blades were sharp out of the box and after I touched them up, they were razor sharp. I have several different brands of pocket knives and this one has become my favorite carry knife. Would like to hear comments or opinions on the quality of these knives.
Thanks,
Birdhunter:D [/quote]

Bear Claw Chris Lappe · Wed Jan 25, 2006 11:56 pm

Henckels are great knives from the few I have seen, they are actually made under contract by Boker these days and Boker makes some of the best pocketknives out there.

LC · Post by LC » Thu Jan 26, 2006 12:50 am

A while back I bought (2) 4-blade stockmans from Mike at CollectorKnives and was impressed by the quility of them. Looks and finish to me is top notch

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Thu Jan 26, 2006 1:24 am

Thanks guys for the replies. Also for the info, I was not aware that they were made by Boker.

longbeachbum · Post by **longbeachbum** » Thu Jan 26, 2006 3:37 am

Another thing is it almost certainly has 420 HC stainless blades. My understanding is the Boker made Henckels are all made with that steel. However, I'm not 100% sure that they ALL are but I'm reasonable sure that most of them are.

A common topic of discussion on this board lately has been what brands are made on contract by which makers. In case you are interested, here is what I believe we have consensus on:

Boker makes:

Henckels
Russell Green River Works

The Olbertz Factory Makes:

Bulldog
Fightin Rooster
Weidmannsheil
Indian Head
Eye Brand
Shapleigh's

Camillus makes:

Moore Maker (Delrin and Buffalo Horn slipjoints and Roper linerlock)
Remington

Queen makes:

Moore Maker (Bone and stag slipjoints)

Queen also makes Schatt & Morgan and Robeson, but these are just different Queen product lines, not made on contract for someone else.

If I blew it on any of the above, someone please correct me.

PA Knives · Post by **PA Knives** » Thu Jan 26, 2006 12:56 pm

I am glad you brought this subject up, because a lot of collectors assume that the name on the tang is the manufacturer. In MOST cases this isn't true. Especially in the old vintage knives. Typically hardware houses bought knives from manufacturers and then had their name stamped on the tang. There are litteraly hundreds of these examples out there. For example, I have a Gilbert, Harrisburg knife that is an early Schrade. Usually the orginal companies name on the tang brings bigger $$$$ but not always. For Example Clauss Freemont was made by CASE and they command nearly as much money for their patterns. Just my unofficial opinion. thanks guys.

"now take out a piece of paper and turn your books to page one"

There will be a quiz on this

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:46 pm

Would you give me your opinion of the 420 HC stainless steel? My Henckels sharpens easily an holds an edge well.

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Thu Jan 26, 2006 9:47 pm

Would you give me your opinion of the 420 HC stainless steel? My Henckels sharpens easily an holds an edge well.

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:10 am

Well I'm crushed

I just started collecting Moore Maker knives and now you tell me that they are not made by Moore Maker in Matador TX but they are being made by two different companies depending on what handles they have.

It makes you wonder how they can guarantee quality control when two different companies are making knives that are being sold under one name. No matter how good the the contract company is they will in some way be different from the other contract company...What if Ford hired the old Yugo car company to manufacture cars at their plant to be sold as Ford's ?

I know it may sound stupid to most but what is being sacrificed in quality as the work is farmed out to the best bid...

OK enough ranting...

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 2:13 am

Hey wait a minute I believe I have owned a couple of Fords made by Yugo...

agteacher2 · Post by **agteacher2** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:29 am

I don't know about other companies but I do know that Moore Maker specifies Very High quality 1095 high carbon steel blades and will only accept high quality parts for the rest of their knives. As far as quality control goes, each and every Moore Maker knife is handled, inspected and packed by at lest one of about four people and most of these are named Moore.

As for the practice of contracting knives from a manufacturer with your mark. This is a practice that dates back to the very infancy of the US knife industry. If you study the history of the entire Case knife family, practically every single family brand started out as a jobber. Essentially buying knives from a manufacturer and stamping them with your name and selling them as your product. These originals were imported mostly from Sheffield England and Solingen Germany, or purchased, in the case family from any one of several brothers uncles or cousins. Even today we have maybe 5 or 6 actual manufactures of bulk numbers of knives in the US.

Sorry I think I got carried away. But I'll still put my Moore Maker up against anything you got from most manufacturers.

JMO and a few facts,
Jeff

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 3:39 am

Well,
Jeff beat me to a diatribe.

I'll just say, there are very few companies in the good old U.S.A. that actually make production knives here in the States. Not a rant, just the way it is, I guess. Contract work has been a staple of the business, just as Jeff and pa knives have stated in here.

Moore Maker does have nice knives, made to good standards...but, they are made by Queen and Camillus.

Bill

agteacher2 · Post by **agteacher2** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:07 am

di•a•tribe

Pronunciation: (dī'u-trīb"), [key]
—n.
a bitter, sharply abusive denunciation, attack, or criticism: repeated diatribes against the senator.

Random House Unabridged Dictionary, Copyright © 1997, by Random House, Inc., on Infoplease.

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Fri Jan 27, 2006 4:51 am

Thank you for that trip to the woodshed.

Yes... I was prepared to go off about most foreign slipjoints/knives, and contract knives in general... (a diatribe

) ...but your very well put post (yours was not a diatribe... if it sounded like I implied that, I do apologize) gave me pause, and prevented me from doing so......saving my tail, as it were. Thanks.

Bill

EDITED: for a little clarity of thought.

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:25 am

Sorry for being so naive about all this but for me part of allure about knives has always been the thought that I really was buying something that for instance was made by the same company that has been making knives since 1731...Why else would they put that on their knives and packaging if they did not want you to believe that was the kind of craftsmanship and experience you were getting???

Is it good salesmanship or bait and hook???

Mmm let me buy a knife, hey lookee here this company has made knives since the dawn of time, that does it for me, I am buying their knives...Only to find out later that the knife never saw the light of day in the original company...

Does this make the knife inferior, probably not but it is still pushing the boundary's of Paul Harvey's "And Now You Know The Rest Of The Story"...

Hey what can I say I am pretty green in what I know of knife manufacturing and evidently this has been the way it's done since just after Noah got off the ark...I appreciate the knowledge of those who know about knives here and the sharing of it with others...

I still plan on collecting Moore Maker knives and others, maybe one day I may even get a chance to stop by Matador, TX and watch the day to day operations...

I will even try to bring along this fellow along with me...He is a serious chap...

http://www.rod-neep.co.uk/rod/knives/re ... index.html

Diatribe - I thin Indian tribe who is making a new infomercial

You guys are using words way out of my vocabulary...Stop it your making me feel like the dumb farmer I am...

longbeachbum · Post by **longbeachbum** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:27 am

birdhunter wrote:Would you give me your opinion of the 420 HC stainless steel? My Henckels sharpens easily an holds an edge well.

It's the same stainless that Case uses, as well as Queen, Buck and many others. It's very common and I think everyone would agree that when properly heat treated it is very servicable, particularly in a slipjoint.

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:39 am

Thanks for the info. Iam learning.

agteacher2 · Post by **agteacher2** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:53 am

On the Rod Neep review I spoke to Waylon Moore about that deal a while back and he was offered a replacement but it was refused.

I have recieved knives from Case as well as Moore Maker that I didn't feel were quite up to par and both have replaced them without any arguement. I also knew a guy that had to take his $60K cadillac in for repairs right after he bought it.

Even knife makers and quality control inspectors have to work on Friday at 4:55 and at 7:59 on Monday morning.

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Sat Jan 28, 2006 2:59 am

I agree with Jim about 420HC...if properly heat treated it does the job for about 90% of pocketknife users. It's not a chopper's steel, but a slicer's steel...just what most slipjoints are used for (besides whittlin', of course

). The blade shape and grind are equally as important, IMO.

Today's Henckels' knives are nice German knives...but not the best German knives, or likely to be particularly collectable, since they are contract knives. JMO, of course.

As far as Moore Maker knives...good contract knives, with good folks backing them up.....this is what's in my pocket right now...

Bill

EDITED: one more thought about shape and grind.

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 12:19 am

I thought that your testimony's on Moore Maker knives could only be enhanced by this testimony:

My preferences can be summed up in a few sentences when it comes to skinning knives; I like a folding knife that follows a "muskrat" or "trapper" pattern, and I like a fixed-blade drop-point a few inches long. With those two knives I can skin, quarter, butcher if I have to, cape, skin the feet if I want them, and cut off my bunions if they should need it.

I want those knives to have carbon-steel blades that take and hold an edge, and I don't want to have anything so hard that I spend half of my life trying to remove steel from the edge of it, or so soft that I have to sharpen it every three minutes. Stainless steel is by and large worthless for a serious working knife when used conventionally (except for ATS-34; I've not used a knife made from it, but it is apparently one of the finest knife steels, bar none, on the planet). Most manufacturers use one of the 440's, and they don't take or hold an edge worth a lick, although they WILL stay nice and shiny under most circumstances, so you'll always have a pretty knife, even if it is a dull one.

Both of the skinning knives that I carry are carbon steel, neither of them cost me an arm and a leg, and I'm very satisfied with both of them.

My pocketknife is a three-bladed model with jigged-bone handles from Moore Maker, in Matador, TX. The blades are 101 carbon steel, and they'll take an edge that's scary-sharp; you want to make sure that edge stays on your victim instead of your knuckles. Mr. Moore sells that knife of about $70.00, and anyone who's ever taken the time to look at the springs and pins and bolsters and whatnot on a pocketknife should understand what a bargain that is. The knife has subtle features that make it easier to use, too; the "toe" on the spey blade is slightly longer than, say, a Shrade or Buck; the other two blades have slightly more belly to put more edge on the hide, and the two skinning blades lock at a decided angle to the body of the knife so that they sit right where they ought to be (an anatomically and ergonomically correct angle, for those of you who are hip to such things).

On top of everything else, it's a handsome knife; the yellow jigged bone and the nickel-silver bolsters and the maker's mark on the shield make it stand out from the mass-produced Japanese stuff.

Mr. Moore doesn't have a Website up yet, although they are working on one, so for now you'll have to write or call for a catalog. By the way, this is the second knife that I've owned that was made by Moore Maker; the first one somehow escaped my grasp and control, and I spent a whole calling season missing it, because I didn't for the life of me know how to find another one. The next summer I was cleaning out a drawer and stumbled across the box that it had come in, and I took the phone number off of the lid and called down to Matador.

Mr. Moore himself answered the phone (which isn't all that remarkable; the outfit is run by two brothers and two sons, so I suppose that I had to talk to one Mr. Moore or another) and after we had a nice little visit, I gave him a model # from the box (#5903; the Three Backspring Whittler) and told him that the knife that I came loose of had jigged bone handles, I asked him if he took credit cards.

"No, son, we don't," was the answer, which pleased me none at all; I wanted the knife NOW, and I didn't want to have to fool about with Postal Money Orders and whatnot, in addition to having to suffer through the turnaround time. "But," he continued, "I'll put that knife in the mail today, and I'll just put the bill in the box."

I greeted this with a rather intelligent "Huh?" and made the poor man repeat himself; I didn't think that anyone did business thataway anymore.

Two days later the knife came in the mail, and sure enough there was the invoice. I cut him a check and sent it on it's way, and I decided that Mr. Moore and his products were Aces High in my book. You ought to try one of his knives; I don't think that they'll disappoint anyone.

Here is the website this came from:
http://www.coyotegods.com/knives.shtml

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 12:34 am

That's a good story sunburst. However, just for your enjoyment.....

http://catalog.mooremaker.com/browseGro ... p_id=29383

Bill

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 12:43 am

Ahhh, Just like a breathe of fresh air

The addiction intensifies

Thanks Bill

birdhunter · Post by **birdhunter** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 7:45 am

I really like this forum. I have gained more knowledge in the few days that I have been here, than any of the books on knives I have read. However my better half may not like it so well. I started this post asking about Henckels knives and before I know it I have a Moore Head stockman with buffalo handles ordered.

sunburst · Post by **sunburst** » Sun Jan 29, 2006 1:44 pm

Birdhunter,

It's a very scary thing this knife collecting...

...I started off buying Henckels here and there, then Hen & Rooster, then Boker. Now it's FightN Rooster, Bulldog, Weidmannsheil, Moore Maker in flavors of stag, pearl, buffalo, wood, bone.

And just when I think I have a little bit of knowledge on knives I learn that I have not even started walking yet.

The folks here on this site are really good for making your spouse think you have lost your mind as you plop down or order that knife you did not even know you wanted yesterday...There are great folks here with insightful thoughts and courteous help and like you I appreciate the fact that I was able to find this site....

Welcome to the pack....Now on to important stuff

...Make sure you show us a picture of your knife when it comes in. And what are you getting next??? I am thinking Indian Head !!!

Take care,

Sunburst

wt3l · Post by **wt3l** » Mon Jan 30, 2006 12:16 am

Well Fellas, Since I admit that I am NOT the brightest crayon in the box...I will just say this. I buy the knives that apeal to me and several things go into wheather or not I will buy a knife. But you know what, thanks to this website, the knowledge that many members share, and the love we all have for the hobby, I am constantly informed on just "HOW" to go about collecting knives. Nobody wants to get "burned" but sometimes it can and does happen. However, thanks to those of you on this site who have much knowledge on the subject of knives and are every ready, willing, and able to share that knowledge. THAT, gentlemen and ladies is why I for one spend more time on this web site than any other. I work hard for my money and I want to build a knife collection that I can and will be proud of. I want to know all about each knife. Thanks again to those of you who "DO" indeed know a lot. I hope to get there some day. Hey Sunburst...GREAT pic of a very nice knife. later keith j.

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