Whittler or Stockman?

[Old Hunter]

My small whittler collection grew by 25% this week with the addition of a Colonel Coon split backspring whittler. In looking over my four whittlers I notice than only the Buck, with three springs, and the Colonel Coon wedge spring, have the main blade nestled between the two small blades. My Schrade 863 and my Remington R-14D each are built like stockman knives, with the main clip blade operating on one spring and the two smaller blades at opposing sides of the adjacent backspring. I thought the definition of what is a whittler was determined by the main blade being centered between the two smaller blades - I guess not, eh?

[philco]

Now you've gone and opened a can of worms...........

[Big Barn]

Not to make any corrections but you've only got two Whittler's in your pictures. They are the top two knives of your middle picture.

[tjmurphy]

Only the Col. Coon is a true whittler.

[dcgm4]

The two on the left side in the first picture are stockmans. Because of the coping blade, which is often used in whittling/woodworking, they are known as "Carpenter's Stockmans."

Regardless of what you call them, all four knives are awesome.

[tjmurphy]

Camillus referred to them as "Carpenter/Whittler". And you are correct, all four are outstanding and if JerryD could get them out of the pic they would disappear, never to heard from again!!

[jerryd6818]

As T. J. said, only the Colonel Coon is a true whittler. That said, the Remington R-14 and the Schrade 863 are clones of the Camillus #72 and commonly called whittlers because the Camillus #72 (of which there were multitudes made) was originally called the "Carpenter's and Whittler's knife". Sometime between 1965 and 1972 "Carpenter's" was dropped from the name and thereafter they simply called it a "Whittler".

Many brands were made in this pattern, most by Kastor brands but some in the Schrade/Ulster family. One of the easy ways to spot a Schrade/Ulster is by the handle pins and the secondary clip blade profile. The handle pins on a Schrade/Ulster are placed closer to the bolsters. The profile of the secondary clip blade is different than a Camillus/Kastor made knife. You have to compare the blades side by side to see the difference.

I can't prove it but it is my opinion Camillus was the originator of this pattern and it went over so well others copied it and now this pattern is called a "whittler" no matter who makes it. Think Kleenex syndrome.

I understand that technically it's a "stockman" but I doubt any movement to change it's common name from "whittler" to "stockman" would succeed.

I love this pattern and keep a constant eye out for variations of it. I don't have as many as Carmillus but I'm workin' on it.


1946 Catalog

1972 Catalog

Camillus #72 Whittler.JPG (37.23 KiB) Viewed 2829 times

[jerryd6818]

Camillus referred to them as "Carpenter/Whittler". And you are correct, all four are outstanding and if JerryD could get them out of the pic they would disappear, never to heard from again!!

I have to exercise self control to keep from buying variations I already have just because it's this pattern (I call 'em all 72s no matter who made 'em).

[Old Hunter]

Thank you gentlemen for all the good information - you have cleared up my confusion about the differences and explained the evolution of the Camillus (and clones design). I think I am most attracted to the split spring / wedge spring design and will be on the look-out for a few more of this variation.

[jerryd6818]

I think I am most attracted to the split spring / wedge spring design and will be on the look-out for a few more of this variation.

Whew!! Thank you Jesus. One less competitor.

The traditional whittler is a very attractive pattern. I can see why you're drawn to it. To me, knives are like women. Most of us pick 'em for their looks and not their brains.

[Elvis]

Jerry's right in that Camillus started calling the swell center stockman-like pattern a whittler. Personally I believe it was because of the small clip blade which is common to the swell center whittler pattern. I'd also call the Buck a whittler because of the blade-fall. It just isn't a split-back like the Coon. There are two backspring whittlers without the splitback, whittlers with it, and 3 backspring whittlers, but because the main blade is opposite, and falls between the two small blades, they are all whittlers. (2 backspring w/o splitback = Case Seahorse. 2 backspring splitback = the Col. Coon or the Case 83. 3 backspring = the Buck or the Case (late 90's and early 2000's) 6308.)

[ironmage]

Now that is why I love this site.You always learn something new from thees guys.I wish I had heard about this site years ago.Now I find it is my go to site for knife information all most every time.Thanks to all.

[jerryd6818]

Early Carpenter's and Whittlers pattern with the pen and coping blades. My favorite.

Still called Carpenter's and Whittlers pattern but now with a clip and coping secondary blades.

Compare the handle pin placement and secondary clip blade profile on the bottom knife ("Sears Craftsman" Ulster 63) to the top four (Camillus). Also note the Camillus knives have match strike pulls and the Ulster doesn't.

Edit: I just noticed the Ulster main clip blade has a longer "nose" (slant to the tip) than the Camillus knives.

[Mossdancer]

Thought I would bring this forward as I just found a broken one. The small clip was kaput. Found this thread after I had reprofiled the blade to lend more credence to it being a whittler. Listed it and turns out it also has a lazy main clip that I could not make work so I pulled it from auction and will enjoy for awhile.

moss

[TripleF]

I think I am most attracted to the split spring / wedge spring design and will be on the look-out for a few more of this variation.

Whew!! Thank you Jesus. One less competitor.

The traditional whittler is a very attractive pattern. I can see why you're drawn to it. To me, knives are like women. Most of us pick 'em for their looks and not their brains.

ROFL.......ROFL......ROFL........
Busted a gut on both replies Jerry!

[btrwtr]

Now you've gone and opened a can of worms...........

At risk of turning a few more worms loose here is a previous post on the subject of whittlers.

Wayne

http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... =4&t=40366

[djknife13]

Western's 6504 stockman (Boulder Era) has a oversized spring and main clip blade along with a small clip instead of a pen and a coping blade and they stamped "whittler" under the pattern number on the tang. Of course they also made 4 inch sleeveboard whittlers they called it an engineers knife, and a 461 Mechanics and Carpenters Special that most of would call a whittler. The only one I know of they called a whittler was the 6504 stockman pattern. I suppose we shouldn't use Western to clear up anything. They just made knives and didn't seem to get caught up in names,

[jerryd6818]

Moss -- I really like what you did with the small clip on that Schrade 863.