Valley Lines / Stabilized Fractures / and CRACKS

[IMBand]

First off - I love my GEC's.......every one of them............................however,

Lately I have recieved a knife or two that have anomallys in the stag. I have been told that
these are 'natural valley lines' in the stag and they are normal. I have been told that any
fractures in GEC nautural handle materials are 'stabalized and will never seperate'.

My comment is this...........these anonmally can look funny when they run right through a
pin!! I have purchased a few EDC models that have smaller issues than 2 of my #85's.
One of the #85's I could see had an issue but I am gonna EDC so no biggie I guess.

I am posting this to see what you guys think about it, or am I the only one that has knives
like this? I will be returning the next knife(s) delivered to me that have ANY issue near a pin,
unless I was full aware at the time of order.

I will close by saying......I love my GEC's.......every one of them!!

IM

[tjmurphy]

Just my opinion, I think that with the limited quantities that GEC sends out the door, that they could be a little more selective and pay a little more atterntion to final fit and finish. With GEC there's no excuse for sub-par materials and workmanship. In your case Trev, it's like buying a new car and finding a scratch on it and the salesman tells you not to worry, it won't rust, it's got good primer under the paint. Just an opinion.

[big monk]

Hey Trevor **** you and I have discussed this,in private messages and I still say,that there has been ""more and more and more"" of the ""PIN_CRACKS""__""Valley Lines""__ or "'Abnomalties"" that you speak of, ____ in,the last few months,than I have seen in 5 years ????????--- I even ""SENT AN E-MAIL"" to GEC (Christine) about this ""PROBLEM"",along with several photos of knives,with the "'PIN_CRACKS"" and have never gotten a reply ?????? ____a great number of the #57 Burnt Stags,had this problem and now,the #85's are showing signs of this as well ?????_____ doen't matter if the scales are stablized or not !! a crack is a crack,and the first thing,you look for,buying a stag handle knife,is ""chips & cracks ???_________the Primitive Bone,is advertised,as having ""natural,cracks & stress fractures"" that have been stabalized, but the stag is not ???_______I love my GEC"S, ( all 300 or so ),but I ""DO NOT"" want cracks or Valley Lines or whatever other names, you call a PIN-CRACK"" ,in my STAG scales !!!!!!!!!!!____ I myself,really "blow up" photos (back & front) to check,before buying now !!!! I just don't want the hassle of sending knives back, that should never have been sent out for sale, in the first place**** I have never,had a problem,with returns,refunds,exchanges, or repairs ,from any dealer or GEC factory___but I would rather not have to return a knife at all_____just my opinion,Monk

[IMBand]

You are correct TJ, short runs of 25-35 should be checked individually.

Monk - Thanks for that post - I had been debating about even posting on this subject and
am glad that others feel the same. I like to be easy going, but I may need to resell at some
point and I would never be able to list MINT with a crack/fracture, wether GEC sold it to me
as 'new/mint' or not.

GEC - Please watch more carefully, or readjust your pin-spinner settings!!??

I love all of my GEC's - lets get this little issue corrected!!


IM

[HiPower]

certainly any fissures or checks or cracks that are at pins or that traverse the entire scale would be suspect. i have only had one to return & i was certainly very pleased with the distributors replacement. dealing with a great distributor is your best alternative & since the dealers can return to gec knives they consider undesirable, i believe enough returned products to the factory will make a greater statement than any letters or phone calls. HiPower

[theblindog]

sorry to hear this Trevor, IMO, for their price range, a crack is unacceptable, I hope GEC can make it right in the future.

we all love our GEC, and it's for their own good that you brought this matter. Trevor, thanks for posting this

[knifeswapper]

Just to help clarify for GEC. Is a valley line, or natural line that exist in the stag before it is ever placed on the knife, alright as long as it doesn't end up getting placed near a pin? Just to be specific, a valley line almost never goes all the way thru the stag. And I have seen less than 10 stress cracks in GEC (non-EDC) stag in 5 years.

I have noticed the red stag and somewhat in general burnt stag that they could spend another couple of minutes trimming the stag to avoid putting any natural anomalies near a pin. But when it is near a pin, it automatically is deemed a pin crack (rightly so).

I see it quite a bit in the older Case knives with popcorn stag and even the newer premier stag lines; but wonder if that doesn't have something to do with Case's actions on general stag. They do not take stock off the back and then start cutting the front down in so far out that they don't leave any natural texture. But that eliminates the visibility of any surface lines and leaves that nice clean inner stag look.

Many times I think it is hard for the factory to get a firm grasp on what is expected. The first batch of primitive bone I received from them was advertised to have some natural fissures, etc. We I got a couple of complaints so sent every one with a line back to the factory and they re-distributed them. Then I started getting calls from customers asking if I had some of that "really cracked up mess". The new request of the day was for primitive bone with as many cracks as possible.

Most returns that they get go right back out the door to someone who is tickled to death with them. Occasionally there will be one that needs re-categorizing as an EDC and sold at a price reduction. But it still amazes me that when you shoot a lineup of 10 stag knives and have a couple that have several of these lines in them; they will be in the top percentile to leave. So somewhere there is a silent group that may not necessarily like the lines, but likes the stag that it comes on.

But, as far as quality control at the factory, I think if they kept a running tally of what hard core collectors liked and didn't like on an individual basis; they could probably release about 20% of their total production. Because as someone famous once said, if we all liked the same thing we'd all be married to the same woman.

But, in the end, the GEC factory will bend over backward to make you happy. And MANY items they get back knives they can't find a thing wrong with; but they will happily remedy the problem with the customer. Because perception is reality and they are working in the world of perception. One good flame on a forum cost them 10 possible customers and one good praise gains back 1.

[IMBand]

This was not a flame and I am not interested in returning any knives at this time. I don't mind when
a knife has interesting things going on in the stag, but I have two that are AT PINS. I think I clearly
stated how I feel about GEC and that for me it seems a small problem that needs attention. I post alot
of knives for a first year collector imo, and I speak very highly of GEC 99.5% of the time. Fair is fair
though and i posted this here to see if I was alone on this or what. One other loyal GEC customer has
stated that he is seeing issues, so at least I am not the Lone Ranger here.

I will post pics of the 2 #85's I am talking about. These two knives should have been sold as EDC's imo.

I will continue to spend most of my knife budget with GEC and am happy to do so, but I will not accept knives
with pin cracks again. As far as GEC understanding what's expected.....it doesn't help that
distributors are re-selling knives that are returned, maybe let GEC decide what gets resold - at least that
way they could see whats being sent back by thier customers?? (esp if the dist cant see an issue).

I did not start this to figure out what GEC needs to do, only to see if others were seeing cracks.
I got a clear answer on it I think. Thanks Mike for your words also, I appreciate you and your EARLY
RESERVE is genious...THANKS for it.

Pin cracks are Knife101 - if GEC lets em out the door, they should EXPECT these posts imo.


IM

[Ramrod]

IM,
Those cracks bother me too when they go right to a pin.
Out in the open, I dont mind them, but straight to a pin, no bueno.
Mark

[knifeswapper]

Yep, regardless of their source; those are both pin cracks. The one on the left looks like a natural line, but not the right (stress cracks are straight lines as compared to meandering veins). Nonetheless, the customer is the one that has to be happy. If you don't like it, the dealer doesn't like, and GEC doesn't like it.

I have even told the factory that I don't want EDC's with genuine pin cracks. A crack is a defect, not a cosmetic issue. I get them in the EDC's from time to time, but they get the old DEEP DISCOUNT applied to them.

[gino]

Trevor, that would bother me also I dont care what it is or what its called.

[paulsvintage]

i have a few too ! don't want any more at the price were paying

[jerryd6818]

Mike, as long as you're here, what's with the high polish GEC is putting on the stag? Does everyone like that? Have you had any complaints? For me, it's not a deal breaker but IMO it looks like a coat of high gloss polyurethane. I'm interested in your opinion as someone who is very familiar with GEC and their knives.

[2Dead]

I try to avoid them if I can but I have bought knives, even with pin cracks, if I've seen the pics before ordering. It bothers me most when they are not expected.

[knifeswapper]

Mike, as long as you're here, what's with the high polish GEC is putting on the stag? Does everyone like that? Have you had any complaints? For me, it's not a deal breaker but IMO it looks like a coat of high gloss polyurethane. I'm interested in your opinion as someone who is very familiar with GEC and their knives.

I don't guess I have noticed anything other than a finishing buffing compound and expect they use something to clean the compound out of the valleys.

[big monk]

And this had some of us upset too !!!!!!!_________________ Even Me !!!! _______buttt*** life goes on***