Counterfeit 5383 Whittler on eBay right now...

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 3:51 pm

Here is a pretty obvious fake...

View link here

Bryan

Hawke · Post by **Hawke** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 9:23 pm

Lemme take a stab(pun intended, lol) at this one

"C" has a extra mark at the top of it
"S" is upside not the proper one and upside down

Overall stamp is too wide and deep

What else? teach me pls

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 10:26 pm

The first thing that caught my attention was those brass pins on the back side. See how big they are? Looks like the back side has been rehandled. The tang stamp is suspect also. Among other things... If you look at the lettering closely, you will see that the letters have rounded ends. That is especially evident when you look at the x's. They should have squared ends... (see attached image ... I blew it up to 200%). I'm pretty sure that the shape of the handle is not right either. I would like to compare it to a real one to make sure, but I think the tested era 83 whittlers are slimmer than this one.

Bryan

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 10:58 pm

Bryan,
Thanks for that BIG photo

I can now see the stamp...I also think you can clearly see where the Case name has been stamped overtop of the original stamp.

Bill

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 11:13 pm

Ah Yes !!!!

You have good eyes Bill, I think I can see where the original xx's might have been ground down now that you pointed out what you did...

Is this what you see?

Bryan

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 11:31 pm

Hah,
My eyes aren't that good...

What I see is an s inside the new S (see the top inside loop of the new S)... an E inside a newer thicker E (inside top of the E)....and what looks like an OVERstamp on the big C...ruining the serif.

JMO.

Bill

Edit: You might be right about the XX though. And, I think Hawke is seeing the same thing as I am with the C.

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Sun Nov 27, 2005 11:41 pm

HAHA!

ok... I will have to re-examine. I do think I see residual x's where the xx would be on a 1965 - 1979 Case knife. I think I see the S that you see. Could it be the S in U.S.A. ... ??? ... Does anybody have any younger children with newer eyes who can help us out here?

Bryan

El Lobo · Post by **El Lobo** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 12:09 am

OK,
I think what you may be seeing, is the dating system from a 2000 or newer knife. You know .x.x. etc.
That might explain why the lower stamp looks off...it's struck over the lower dating x.x.x
Then CASE XX could be overstamped to look like the 1920-40 thick CASE stamp.

Then again I could be wrong...But I won't be bidding.

Bill

Hawke · Post by **Hawke** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:13 am

I see the original "S" and "E". This is quite amazing. I didnt notice ththe original letters before, just some odd looking gut-feeling things, but man after you look its amazing what is there. It's really hard to counterfeit well.

I remember one person telling me how folks will get a knife that worn down or have a very light stamp, mill it down and restamp it. Like counterfeit money which is detailed, one could make a new Case Tested Stamp.

The way to spot the milled down effect he said is to look at the tang base where it changes to blade. Make sure both sides are the same. The stamp side, milled down side, could be lower than the non-tang stamped side. A fingernail feel on each side could show this with your eyes closed. This person said he has gone to knife shows and been to guys rooms where they had like a miniture machine shop there! I can see the fun in repairing knives but just could never get any enjoyment from fooling others for profit. Yet, the good counterfeiter might "say" these sames words as I just did. LOL

But, Im not a counterfeiter... Trust Me <-:P

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:15 am

I think what you may be seeing, is the dating system from a 2000 or newer knife. You know .x.x. etc.
That might explain why the lower stamp looks off...it's struck over the lower dating x.x.x
Then CASE XX could be overstamped to look like the 1920-40 thick CASE stamp.

Now that is very possible.

I can't look at it anymore today. My head is starting to hurt.

I'll have to examine the pictures again tomorrow.

Maybe I'll put a loupe up to the computer screen or something

Bryan

agteacher2 · Post by **agteacher2** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:31 am

Wrong Button Sorry

agteacher2 · Post by **agteacher2** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:31 am

This is another from the same seller Suspect Description

Says it is stag finished bone, Isn't this a genuine stag

Check out the return policy - Key word PROVEN

RETURNS: A NON-clothing/jewelry item may be returned within 3 days ONLY if proven NOT to be as described, & refund will be issued on bid price ONLY, minus any & all shipping & insurance costs & eBay fees, provided item is returned insured at your expense, intact & in the same condition as when sent. Absolutely NO returns for "Buyer's Remorse" or any other reason other than gross misrepresentation on my part.

Bryan · Post by **Bryan** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 3:47 am

Hi Jeff,

Looks like that auction was removed. I'm wondering whether or not the seller desearves blame. It appears he/she sells on consignment. I just wonder if someone isn't having that seller do the dirty work for them by consigning knives that are fake unbeknownst to the seller...??? (<--that probably made no sense... If not, it's because I'm tired

)

Anyways... I re-re-examined the images and I like the 2000 or newer theory a lot. All I know for sure is that something is not right.

Bryan

Hawke · Post by **Hawke** » Tue Nov 29, 2005 4:05 am

Good thread for learning. Who's at fault here is not my concern, only to educate ourselves of what looks suspicious.

1. The choir area shows at the very least sharpening. No indention there and the overall length leading to it "feels" too long for mint.
2. Is that an XX under there?
3. Edges of the "E" are too long and is uneven depths. Is it that a double line on the far right side? Matched it on left side where its wider, but right looks double stamped a little.
4. Shouldnt the "Tested" and the "XX" have a bit more space between?

On the plus side, This does not show the pushed up metal near the edges.
(because it was done when the blade was cold verses still warm at the factory. Am I right on this as to why it happens?)