Giving Help with our experience

[knives-are-quiet]

Hi everyone that follows this forum.
I have got a couple of emails from other members interested in starting out repairing & restoring asking for my help and experience.
I told them to get a cheap old knife as a starter and post their projects on this forum and I would help them along with any help they will need.
Although I have a lot of experience in this field I don't know it all.
I am still learning all the time.
There are millions of different types of knives and I haven't repaired them all.
So is anybody else who loves to repair and restore knives up for helping these other members out? Sounds like it could be a lot of fun. Hey, I'll be asking question too.
jamie~ "knives are quiet"

[Elvis]

Hi Jamie,

There are a few of us here that do repairs and restorations and the questions kind of come with the territory. Everyone here seems to realize that you can give someone every last detail of how to work on a knife, but it's who is holding the knife and tools that make the difference. That's why the information seems to flow freely around here and everyone is as helpful as possible (check out the tutorial section...nicely done!).

It's great having another experienced knife mechanic join us on AAPK and I honestly hope that you're made to feel as welcome as I was when I first got here. Trying to get to the point here, anytime a questions comes up, if you care to post it, it will just help educate the rest of us because like you said, "Although I have a lot of experience in this field I don't kow it all.". Well, the same applies to me and everyone else who's honest with themselves because nobody's seen it all. So thanks for joining and offering to help us all out (experienced or not) as we hope we can help you. I know the swap postings have came in handy more than once as well as little tips I've picked up. The only other thing I have to say about this place is that I came because of the knives, but stayed because of the people. I hope you will too. Welcome!

(Whatever Q & A you can work up as mentioned in your post.....count me in!)

[trey]

Jamie and Elvis,

Thanks for offering to help. You guys are great.

Trey

[knives-are-quiet]

I noticed a want add who no one was responding to asking for some cheap starter folders for a Gentleman named Sam and his 13 year old Son who would like to learn repairing and restoring. I thought it to be the right thing to do and responded with an offer to help them out. I mean, thirteen year olds these days are easily lured into activities we are all well aware of. If this Gentleman can keep his Son busy with a hobby that is not only fun for the both of them but productive and educational at the same time I have no problem offering my assistants.

________________________________________________________________________

Here are the posts and emails we have been exchanging.
Want Add Post:

I'm looking to buy some old knives that I can work on that will help me get started in restoration and repair. Not looking for anything fancy, just some I can practice on and hopefully get them back into EDC shape if I'm lucky.
Thanks, Sam

Reply to Post:

Hello,
I noticed your post about looking for some project knives.
Are you just starting out wanting to repair and restore knives?
I myself have been doing it for almost 30 years.
Email me or post on this thread you started about your interests in repairing and restoring and maybe I can help you out with some starter knives.
What type of knives are you looking for, fixed or folders?
I can also offer you my years of experience in helping you along with your project.
jamie~

Email response:

Thank you very much for replying. I am just looking for some old beat up
> folders that I can use to get started in a little repair and restoration
> without taking a chance on destroying a good knife. I've never attempted
> any type of work on a pocket knife but always found it very interesting and
> wanted to try it. I also have a 13 year old son that is showing tons of
> interest in learning about knives and how to work on them. At first, we
> were just going to start our own little collection of Case knives, but
> after discovering this forum and doing a bit of research, we realized that
> learning the inner workings of a folding knife and eventually reaching the
> point where we might be able to bring one back to life is where we really
> want to be. I have already picked up both Adrian Harris and Ben Kelly's
> books on repair and restoration and started picking up a few items to begin
> putting a small shop together so things are beginning to happen. Any help
> you would give us will be greatly appreciated. Our budget is limited but we
> don't mind to pay for what we need to get started.
> Thank you again,
> Sam

My email reply:

Hi Sam,
I am glad to see you & your son are interested in a hobby together.
I think that's awesome. I started my interest in knives at a very young age when I was in the cub scouts and got my first scout knife. I learned a lot from the scouts and took it serious enough to work my way to become an eagle scout. I still have all the knives I received during the ten years I was in the scouts, one cub scout, two boy scout and the ultimate eagle scout knife. I also have the first knife I successfully repaired when I was your sons age. That's when my love for this hobby of repairing knives began and I am now 50 years old and still love it. That first knife I repaired had four tools. All were broken or missing but the main blade so I turned it into a single blade knife.
The only tools I had were a screwdriver, hammer, my Dads hand drill and some sand paper. I used finish nails for the pins. The knife didn't come out all that bad. But it wasn't my first attempt. I messed up a few before I finally learned so don't be disappointed if the first few are failures. We learn from our mistakes.
If you need any help figuring out what you will need to start out tool wise, just ask on the forum restoration & repair or email me.
I do know the first and foremost thing about working on knives is safety. Just make sure you and your son have the appropriate safety equipment. Eye protection, gloves and dust masks. Your eyes , hands and health are the most important tools you will need.
I do have two or three old cheap knives from the 60's or 70's laying around somewhere that I would be willing to donate to you & your sons new venture into the art of knife repair. All you would have to do is reimburse me for the postage and promise me you will post pictures of the progression of your projects on all about pocketknives repair and restoration forum so myself and the other folks can help you out and so we can all learn together. My personal email address is *********
Email me your home address so I can get the knives to you.
I live in Pennsylvania and not too sure how long they will take to get to you since you do not have where your located in your profile on the AAPK forum.
I'll dig out those knives tomorrow and check them out and when you return email me I'll send pictures and suggestions to what you might be able to create out of these old knives.
You and your Family take it easy and I'll be in touch.
"jamie"
aka - knives are quiet


Email response:

That would be great. I really appreciate it. Just let me know what the postage is
and I'll get it out to you. My son will be excited. I'll post plenty of pics of
the progress as it happens. Thanks again.
Sam

My response:

Hi Sam,
I have a couple of knives here that I think would be perfect for someone just starting out.
They should help you & your Son understand the basic inner mechanics of the spring knife without being too technical. Reading about the inner workings and how to repair is one thing and looks very easy on paper. But you will find out that it isn't as easy as it seems when you start hands on learning. The two knives are Imperial's that were made in the 60's or 70's. One is a cheaper version than the other with clip on scales / bolsters and is called a Kamp King. The other is a higher quality and has true bolsters that are pinned.
They both are utility /camping/Scout type knives. The cheaper ones can opener is broke off but I will be inclosing two replacements when I send the knives to you. One of them should fit. So this knife will have all it's parts.
The higher quality one has both the main & secondary blades broke off and I will be inclosing a spare main blade that is not the exact size (thinner gage) for that knife but you should be able to get it to work with the help from myself and others on AAPK forum.
Maybe eliminate the smaller blade all together which would involve thinning one of the springs. Or maybe one of the other members could hook you up with a replacement blade.
Other than that these two knives have no significant rust.
Here are a bunch of pictures of the knives.
I'll send them out as soon as I find the chance and let you know when to expect them to arrive at your PO Box.
In the meantime you and your Son keep studying those books you have on knife repair.

Take it easy,
jamie~


__________________________________________________________________

Here’s some pictures of the knives I will be sending Sam and his Son.

[tc3500]

That is awesome of you to help out in that way. I also will be attempting my first
knife project pretty soon. I am going to start with a couple knife kits I think. My
experience from a few different things tells me that sometimes it easier to build
from new than to re-model. This may or may not be true on knives, but have already
ordered the kit and some handle materials. I dont need any fixer knives as I have
managed to get a few from the bay, but its nice to know that there are people here
that are willing to help out. So much knowledge here, be a shame not to try and soak
up some of it. Thanks again guys.

[Elvis]

TC....Good luck with the kits. As with anything made to put together yourself, some work better than others. If you have to re-drill a hole or sand/file a piece to make it a perfect fit, don't be too surprised, but most I've seen go together without too much hassle. Glad to hear you have some used ones to practice on also. Should you decide to get into repair in a serious fashion, those will teach you a lot more than we could explain by typing. I think I'm quoting Orvet here when I say that repair and restoration can prove to be more habit-forming than collecting. I know that in my case, he's right. The time spent in my little workshop is relaxing and helps get the mind off of other things.

[jerryd6818]

Jamie, perhaps you might suggest to your new buddy Sam, TL-29s as learning projects. They're as common as chicken feathers, cheap to buy and very well built. When done properly, they make a great looking custom for EDC.

Klein knives would also be good to use as learning tools. Made in the USA and get no respect so they're cheap to buy. I saw a lot of 32 which included Imperial, Latama, Bassett, Camco and Klein go on eBay for $9.99 plus $4.95 shipping. Who cares what's in the lot if you're going to take them apart to see what their made of.

Just some suggestions to pass on if you want. Very generous of you to provide knives and repair parts for his first projects.

[paulsvintage]

thanks guys for offering your help. question ? what sizes of pin stock should i have on hand? brass and nickel silver ? thanks, Paul

[knives-are-quiet]

thanks guys for offering your help. question ? what sizes of pin stock should i have on hand? brass and nickel silver ? thanks, Paul

Every size that is available plus all types (brass, nickel, stainless and even iron) if you want to have them on hand for all kinds of knives.
If I decide do a total restore on a knife for someone I evaluate the knife then order all the materials with the deposit the customer gives me. Then if everything goes as planned and the customer is satisfied with the finished product then I'm paid in full.
I do keep most sizes and types on hand for folder repairs as the pins are the usual problem most of the time.

J W

[orvet]

Here is a link to a new thread I started on my sources for pin-stock.
Please go there and list other sources so we can all benefit from each other's knowledge.
http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 37&t=23455

Dale

[brando090]

Thanks guys for (maybe) helping me. Here is a thread;http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 60&t=23446. I bought a bunch of fountain pens, and the guys was generous enough to throw this knife in since i asked him if he had any vintage knifes. Im not sure of its value, and i would like to restore it to better condition.

[knives-are-quiet]

Thanks guys for (maybe) helping me. Here is a thread;http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 60&t=23446. I bought a bunch of fountain pens, and the guys was generous enough to throw this knife in since i asked him if he had any vintage knifes. Im not sure of its value, and i would like to restore it to better condition.

Mr. Brando090
The knife looks like a good one to start out restoring or repairing.
I have personally never worked on a Boker tree brand knife but have worked on many Barlow type. I don't know what substance is all over the one side of the knife "paint"?
It is a good idea to determine what that substance is first to help determine the correct way to remove it.
For the broken tip. You have two options, Reshape the tip or replace the blade.
A better written description of all the problems the knife has along with the pictures plus questions on how top fix the problems will get you answers.
Is the blade loose? "wobble vertical or horizontal".
As for the value as is. I'd be guessing around 20 bucks.
If you reshape the blade properly , It will not change the value and probably lower it.
If you replace the blade correctly without disturbing the patina or changing anything you can increase the value a little bit.
My suggestion would be to fix it up and use it.
Those types of knives are high quality and are an excellent every day user.
Good Luck with it and ask questions to get answers.

J W

[brando090]

Thanks guys for (maybe) helping me. Here is a thread;http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 60&t=23446. I bought a bunch of fountain pens, and the guys was generous enough to throw this knife in since i asked him if he had any vintage knifes. Im not sure of its value, and i would like to restore it to better condition.

Mr. Brando090
The knife looks like a good one to start out restoring or repairing.
I have personally never worked on a Boker tree brand knife but have worked on many Barlow type. I don't know what substance is all over the one side of the knife "paint"?
It is a good idea to determine what that substance is first to help determine the correct way to remove it.
For the broken tip. You have two options, Reshape the tip or replace the blade.
A better written description of all the problems the knife has along with the pictures plus questions on how top fix the problems will get you answers.
Is the blade loose? "wobble vertical or horizontal".
As for the value as is. I'd be guessing around 20 bucks.
If you reshape the blade properly , It will not change the value and probably lower it.
If you replace the blade correctly without disturbing the patina or changing anything you can increase the value a little bit.
My suggestion would be to fix it up and use it.
Those types of knives are high quality and are an excellent every day user.
Good Luck with it and ask questions to get answers.

J W

I was told it was just old tape residue. I was also told to put Goo Gone on it which i am applying now. The knife is in perfect condition excluding the small amount of rust and tape residue. I would like to clean every nook and cranny, but should i risk my inexperience and take it apart carefully and put everything back together again? There is no cracks,etc. How should i clean off the rust?

[knives-are-quiet]

Thanks guys for (maybe) helping me. Here is a thread;http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/kni ... 60&t=23446. I bought a bunch of fountain pens, and the guys was generous enough to throw this knife in since i asked him if he had any vintage knifes. Im not sure of its value, and i would like to restore it to better condition.

Mr. Brando090
The knife looks like a good one to start out restoring or repairing.
I have personally never worked on a Boker tree brand knife but have worked on many Barlow type. I don't know what substance is all over the one side of the knife "paint"?
It is a good idea to determine what that substance is first to help determine the correct way to remove it.
For the broken tip. You have two options, Reshape the tip or replace the blade.
A better written description of all the problems the knife has along with the pictures plus questions on how to fix the problems will get you answers.
Is the blade loose? "wobble vertical or horizontal".
As for the value as is. I'd be guessing around 20 bucks.
If you reshape the blade properly , It will not change the value and probably lower it.
If you replace the blade correctly without disturbing the patina or changing anything you can increase the value a little bit.
My suggestion would be to fix it up and use it.
Those types of knives are high quality and are an excellent every day user.
Good Luck with it and ask questions to get answers.

J W

I was told it was just old tape residue. I was also told to put Goo Gone on it which i am applying now. The knife is in perfect condition excluding the small amount of rust and tape residue. I would like to clean every nook and cranny, but should i risk my inexperience and take it apart carefully and put everything back together again? There is no cracks,etc. How should i clean off the rust?

Brando090,

If you are just starting out I wouldn't take that type of high quality knife apart.
I would start out dismantling a fixed knife first as they are not as complicated.
Or get yourself a folding knife kit. They are not that expensive and you can use materials you can find for the handles to save money like a nice piece of oak or birch you can acquire in the woods and can be whittled to the shape you need.
These kit’s will give you a better aspect of the inner workings of the spring knife.
They come in different skill levels for beginners to experts.
http://www.knifekits.com is one place I have purchased them from and also http://www.jantzsupply.com is another.
If the Boker knife is in good operating condition "no large amount of wobble and still has a fairly good open and close snap plus closes all the way into the liners" I would just clean it up.
I am assuming that the handles are bone? Anything you will be using to clean them should be tested on a small area of the handle first to make sure it won't damage them. Bone is pretty resilient and nothing but probably acid would damage them. You just need to make sure whatever you use won’t dry the bone out. When the handles are plastic is when you need to be more careful with what you use.
Just clean the minor rust off with some fine steel wool and WD40.
After you get all the goo off and the rust stabilized clean the knife with warm water and dish soap then dry with compressed air. You can use a hair dryer. Just don't get too close, about a foot away on high. Then use water displacement like WD40 with a rag and coat the metal.
Use a Q-tip to get the oil down into the liners. Try not to get any on the bone, a little won't hurt them, just don’t soak them.
I am not sure what equipment you have to reshape the blade?
Before I got the funds to purchase my belt / disk sander I reshaped blades by hand with a bastard file and wet dry sandpaper. It takes much longer but it will work.
When you are done shaping you will need to put a defined edge back on the blade which can also be done with the file. Finally the blade will need to be sharpened with a sharpening stone.
Use a picture from the internet of the same type of knife and blade as a reference for the original shape of the blade. The blade will be shorter when you are done but will still be functional.
With all and all said, the main thing with repairing this knife is to make it safe to use.
Take your time and don’t be afraid to ask questions and you should be able to bring that classic knife back to life. When you get more experienced you can then take this knife apart and replace the blade with an original replacement from a parts knife.

J W

[brando090]

Brando090,

If you are just starting out I wouldn't take that type of high quality knife apart.
I would start out dismantling a fixed knife first as they are not as complicated.
Or get yourself a folding knife kit. They are not that expensive and you can use materials you can find for the handles to save money like a nice piece of oak or birch you can acquire in the woods and can be whittled to the shape you need.
These kit’s will give you a better aspect of the inner workings of the spring knife.
They come in different skill levels for beginners to experts.
http://www.knifekits.com is one place I have purchased them from and also http://www.jantzsupply.com is another.
If the Boker knife is in good operating condition "no large amount of wobble and still has a fairly good open and close snap plus closes all the way into the liners" I would just clean it up.
I am assuming that the handles are bone? Anything you will be using to clean them should be tested on a small area of the handle first to make sure it won't damage them. Bone is pretty resilient and nothing but probably acid would damage them. You just need to make sure whatever you use won’t dry the bone out. When the handles are plastic is when you need to be more careful with what you use.
Just clean the minor rust off with some fine steel wool and WD40.
After you get all the goo off and the rust stabilized clean the knife with warm water and dish soap then dry with compressed air. You can use a hair dryer. Just don't get too close, about a foot away on high. Then use water displacement like WD40 with a rag and coat the metal.
Use a Q-tip to get the oil down into the liners. Try not to get any on the bone, a little won't hurt them, just don’t soak them.
I am not sure what equipment you have to reshape the blade?
Before I got the funds to purchase my belt / disk sander I reshaped blades by hand with a bastard file and wet dry sandpaper. It takes much longer but it will work.
When you are done shaping you will need to put a defined edge back on the blade which can also be done with the file. Finally the blade will need to be sharpened with a sharpening stone.
Use a picture from the internet of the same type of knife and blade as a reference for the original shape of the blade. The blade will be shorter when you are done but will still be functional.
With all and all said, the main thing with repairing this knife is to make it safe to use.
Take your time and don’t be afraid to ask questions and you should be able to bring that classic knife back to life. When you get more experienced you can then take this knife apart and replace the blade with an original replacement from a parts knife.

J W[/quote]

I let the knife sit over night with goo gone in every nook and cranny. I am not going to be taking it apart, but with my cleaning (goo gone, and than some water) i think its safe to say the knife is 85%-90% done. I will get some WD-40 and clean the blades with it, i found with my above cleaning i found "Tree" imprinted on the bigger knife blade. With all the goo gone, there is still some in the "valleys", how should i get that out? Q-tips wont work, so i am thinking a razor blade and a little bit of cotton or a rag/t-shirt to put inside of the "valleys" than move it around with the razor blade. A majority of the tape residue came off, but any recommendations to get it all off?

[knives-are-quiet]

Brando~

Q-tips are a good cleaning tool but to get into those small areas I use wooden tooth picks.
I wouldn't use anything metal as it could scratch the surface you are working on if you are not careful.
Use the goo remover to soften the resedue then use the wooden tooth picks to dig it out.
An old soft toothbrush will help also.
If the remover you are using isn't working to get the tape resedue off, try rubbing alcohol.
Lighter fluid will work too but it is a more caustic way. Try the alchol first.
Let me know how you made out.

J W

[brando090]

Brando~

Q-tips are a good cleaning tool but to get into those small areas I use wooden tooth picks.
I wouldn't use anything metal as it could scratch the surface you are working on if you are not careful.
Use the goo remover to soften the resedue then use the wooden tooth picks to dig it out.
An old soft toothbrush will help also.
If the remover you are using isn't working to get the tape resedue off, try rubbing alcohol.
Lighter fluid will work too but it is a more caustic way. Try the alchol first.
Let me know how you made out.

J W

Q-tips are just to small for the "valleys". I have use Goo Gone 2-3 times already, and ive let the Good Gone come out (from the knife sitting in water) overnight. On the metal part GG has made a small bit of it like new (chromey) and i wasnt to get all of it like that. I dont know what i did right with the GG buy im not sure if i can do that with all the metal. Is there chroming solution that will make this knife pop out? And i can find it in my dads garage

[knives-are-quiet]

You will never be able to make the blade look brand new and you shouldn't with a classic knife like that. You want it to show it's age plus it won't take too long before it tarnishes back up. I use a grease wheel to polish old knives "remove scratches" but the metal on these knives has changed with age all the way through.
I guess using fine steel wool and fine wet sand paper and then some sort of metal polish will get the best results by hand.
Will you be or have you already fixed the broken tip on the main blade?
I would attempt that before doing any polishing.
Maybe someone else on this site can give you an idea of what to use to polish the metal on this knife with what you have on hand?

Post some pictures of what you have done so far on this knife.

J W

[brando090]

Im not sure what i did, but i let it sit in Goo Gone overnight once more since there was some in the "valleys" so i got it out, but it looks like it magnatizes to the metal. So i clean it off and now there is a mat black finish on the smaller knife

[knives-are-quiet]

The blade has oxidized. 0000 grade steel wool will remove the tarnish.
Don't use anymore cleaner.
If you are going to reshape that main large blade, file on the edge side close to the tip of the blade rounding it upwards. I wouldn't disturb the top false edge of that type of clip point blade.

http://allaboutpocketknives.com/informa ... blades.JPG
J W

[just bob]

I'm new at this also so I have much to learn. I don't think I would ever suggest to anyone that they begin to learn the basics of knife repair and theory by taking old knives apart and putting them back together. There is just to much involved. If you are trying to replace a blade you must find an old blade to grind and reshape to your needs. When you go to pin it you will find that your pins are either too big or too little and you must turn one down. If you get this tapered you have created a headache. Trying to refit new scales on an old knife is not a job for a person starting out. The frustration would cause many to give up on the first knife they tried.

A far better option is to buy some of those kit knives. Many are less than $5 in Internet auctions. These kits have blades and pins that fit. If you want you can cut a piece of wood from a scrap 2x4 to makes scales out of. When you get good at putting the kits together take them apart and start again. If you crack a scale, make a new one. Once you have this process down pat move on to older knives then. You will know what is involved in the process.

[knives-are-quiet]

I'm new at this also so I have much to learn. I don't think I would ever suggest to anyone that they begin to learn the basics of knife repair and theory by taking old knives apart and putting them back together. There is just to much involved. If you are trying to replace a blade you must find an old blade to grind and reshape to your needs. When you go to pin it you will find that your pins are either too big or too little and you must turn one down. If you get this tapered you have created a headache. Trying to refit new scales on an old knife is not a job for a person starting out. The frustration would cause many to give up on the first knife they tried.

A far better option is to buy some of those kit knives. Many are less than $5 in Internet auctions. These kits have blades and pins that fit. If you want you can cut a piece of wood from a scrap 2x4 to makes scales out of. When you get good at putting the kits together take them apart and start again. If you crack a scale, make a new one. Once you have this process down pat move on to older knives then. You will know what is involved in the process.

I agree. Those kits are good to practice with.
But more to get familiar with the inner workings of a spring knife. Taking a new knife apart with no ware, no rust, no metal fatigue and no historical value is very different than taking apart and putting back together a knife that is more than 100 years old. With the new kit everything is perfectly cut flat and square and is much simpler to work with than uneven, rusted, pitted and warped material.
Then you have to take in account the stress involved.
Those easy kits that I can put together with my eyes closed are a dime a dozen.
With some old antique knives, you might be working on a knife that only a handful still exist . It is quite different when working on new than very old.
I suggest working on abused knives that aren't worth saving first, ones that are rusted, pitted and worn but aren't that old or worth that much. putting them together and taking them apart first to get the feel for repairing and restoring an antique one that is worth saving.

J W