WHO MADE TRYON'S KNIVES?.and QUESTION 2..HAND TANG ETCHING?

[cattaraugus57]

I have a few Tryon's (phila hardware co) and have often wondered how many different cutlery co's made knives for them?..this is question 1.
On This latest parts knife one I picked up,(just because I didn't have one like it. ).....
when Looking at the tang through an eye loupe, the stamping doesn't look like a stamping at all but instead looks etched by hand.
So Question 2. is,did any cutlery co's use other means to mark a tang?
like hand etching.
Sorry but really tried to get a pic of the tang...would not come out.

[chautauqua]

i know utica made knives for them,nyk and some where made in england,anything is possible with the stamps from phila,hardware houses like tyron as most all of them had poor stamps at best,eagle knives are some of the worst alot of times they would sorta grind old stamp off and stamp over top of it with both stamps still visible

[cattaraugus57]

I assume that on small knives the tang/etching is so tiny it was done under a magnifier.
On a few of the Tryons I own and many I've seen I'd say Cattaraugus also made knives for them as well..
It would be great if someone had old company records as to who were their suppliers.

[knife7knut]

I'd be curious as to who made this Tryon knife.The stag has the look of some older Henckels knives I've owned,the shield could be from any one of a number of manufacturers and the master blade is unusual in that the false edge is ground all the way back to the tang.The front bolsters also have an unusual rope shaped design on them.The blades have a nice patina reminiscent of English knives(a grayish color).

[cattaraugus57]

wow,that's a really great Tryon example there knife7knut !
I've never seen one with scales or bolsters like that,really love it thanks for sharing it.
I would guess at it being english made like you mention maybe even a Wostenholm?..I don't know.
Knife history has so many in's and out's to it.
You can spend you're whole life learning about it and end up not know half of it,but I'm trying..

[PA Knives]

HI!

Being the Tryon is a Pennsylvania related company I wanted to JUMP in. Hardware houses sold many different items and had their name put on them. These weren't hardware stores like we know today, they had traveling salesmen that offered a wide variety of items to their loyal customers. A tough business needless to say. The knives were obviously made by a number of different manufacturers and then stamped with the E Tryon's name.

No doubt all of your guesses as to manufacturers are right. Whom ever sold them the knives at the lowest wholesale price got the order.

Nothing I am sure you fellas didn't already know, but I wanted to play teacher for a moment. I included this logo for your enjoyment as well.

[tjmurphy]

Not to hijack the thread and no knife content, but since we are talking about PA, did anyone watch "American Pickers" last night? They were picking in Tidioute, PA at the Tidioute Hotel. Had it not been for this forum that town would have had absolutely no meaning to me. Another thing I learned here. Thanks folks.

[cattaraugus57]

ahh,those were the days huh?
A tough business no doubt but a good one.
thanks for the imput and the logo.

I'm with you TJ would I never have known w/o this forum!
Too bad those guys sold the pinball mach to those pirates so cheap!

[knife-nut]

Not to hijack the thread and no knife content, but since we are talking about PA, did anyone watch "American Pickers" last night? They were picking in Tidioute, PA at the Tidioute Hotel. Had it not been for this forum that town would have had absolutely no meaning to me. Another thing I learned here. Thanks folks.

I was watching that one too. I kept thinking maybe they would find some old advertising or something from one of the old cutlery companies.

[chautauqua]

parker and his cronies picked that town over pretty good about 20 years ago

[Miller Bro's]

So Question 2. is,did any cutlery co's use other means to mark a tang?
like hand etching.

I would like to see a picture of what you are talking about

[tjmurphy]

So Question 2. is,did any cutlery co's use other means to mark a tang?
like hand etching.

I would like to see a picture of what you are talking about

The stamp on this Challenge looks like it may have been engraved.

[Miller Bro's]

The stamp on this Challenge looks like it may have been engraved.

No, it was stamped

[cattaraugus57]

thanks TJ, that's like the Tryon in question I have except the Tryon is even worse.
The lines are not real sharp and look shakey.
I thought maybe it was from the tang stamp being worn ?
becaue I just can't think how they would engrave or etch something that small with any precision.

[PA Knives]

If you think they can't etch that small, look at my thread on the fake C.J. Case Kane pa knife on the general forum. that was done with an etching machine used by jewelers

[cattaraugus57]

I never really thought about it but yeah Jewlers always did engraving/etching
makes sense cause I'd swear this tang is not stamped.

[knife7knut]

Neat old tools! That second one looks like a pantograph.

[Miller Bro's]

I have never seen an old knife that had the makers name acid etched or engraved.

Remington acid etched the pattern numbers on the reverse tang on some of their knives, the name is tang stamped.

If you have looked closely at a tang stamp on an old knife it is pretty easy to see the difference between engraved, etched and stamped.

I am not familiar with the machines you posted, however I bet they were capable of only engraving soft metals, Brass, Silver, Gold, etc. I doubt that machine could engrave a hardened steel knife blade, but I have been wrong before

In case you have never seen a real, old, factory knife tang stamp check out the picture below

[cattaraugus57]

thanks Millerbros for the stamp picture I haven't seen one before.
I'd be inclined to agree that since a knife is hardened it would be really tough to etch or engrave.
If I get a box made so I can scan this Tryon I can show the tang in question.

[Miller Bro's]

I would like to see the tang stamp

[PA Knives]

Dimitri,

I respectfully disagree with you on the comment about not being able to etch knife blades, that the pantograph is exactly the machine that did the C.J. Case fakery I display on that other thread and it is HARD blade etching. If you could see the stamp up-close with a small powered microscope that I use, you can CLEARLY see the half moon swirls in the lettering and the way the line crosses the letter A, rather than being stamped smoothly in. It was an excellent learning adventure for me. The letters began and ended with very small circle at the end of each stroke too. A dead give away that it was not stamped. From a distance (1 foot or so) it looks very convincing, but once I looked through the loupe I was suspicious and got out the pocket microscope I have for knives. BINGO, pantograph work. GREAT pics by the way CAT man

[Miller Bro's]

I respectfully disagree with you on the comment about not being able to etch knife blades, that the pantograph is exactly the machine that did the C.J. Case fakery I display on that other thread and it is HARD blade etching.

David,

I think you are misunderstanding what I am talking about

My comment was not about If it was able to be done, rather I was talking about what the original factory mark would look like and that would be a tang stamp on an authentic original old knife. If you have an old knife that has the maker`s name etched, or lightly engraved chances are the knife is a fake.

I was not discussing what tactics these counterfeiters are using to fake old tang stamps.

Also, the word etch is being used in this thread, when I say Etch I am talking about Acid Etching, as what was done in the old days, not laser or mechanical etching.

I hope this clears things up

[PA Knives]

Dimitri,

My humble apology, I agree with your statements totally. I find your your knowledge of vintage cutlery to be one of the best. Thanks for clearing that up.

David

[Miller Bro's]

No apology necessary my friend

[bonehead]

knife7knut,

Couldn't say who made that knife but I have a few NYKC knives and those bolster's look mighty familar

BH