DE or Western States???

[98src]

I got a small wood handled 2 blade jack ] in a group of knives and noticed that the large blade is marked with the traditional Shapleigh Hardware Co with the DE in a diamond in the middle. Strangely enough the small blade has the arched Western States over Boulder over Colo. My question is did Western States make this knife for Shapleigh. No signs of tampering on this knife and I believe it is as it left the factory. Does anyone know whether Western States made knives for Shapleigh?

DE-1.jpg (36.25 KiB) Viewed 1575 times

DE-2.jpg (47.96 KiB) Viewed 1575 times

[btrwtr]

I got a small wood handled 2 blade jack ] in a group of knives and noticed that the large blade is marked with the traditional Shapleigh Hardware Co with the DE in a diamond in the middle. Strangely enough the small blade has the arched Western States over Boulder over Colo. My question is did Western States make this knife for Shapleigh. No signs of tampering on this knife and I believe it is as it left the factory. Does anyone know whether Western States made knives for Shapleigh?

DE-1.jpgDE-2.jpgDE-3.jpgDE-4.jpg

Unusual that the back of the pen blade doesn't look to be a straight line as shown in the 2nd pic showing the Western States tang stamp. This would suggest that the blade may not be original to the frame and that it was altered to match up to the back spring when fully open. Are there any grind lines at this curved portion of the pen blade back that look out of place?

[zzyzzogeton]

It could be cobbled together from parts

OR

It may have been made by Western for Shapleigh. I know Western made fixed blade hunting knives for Shapleigh as I have seen a few Shapleigh stamped knives assembled with Western's bifurcated tang construction.

[98src]

Two more pictures. The feature mentioned re: the small blade is also present on the large spear blade. I believe the knife has never been apart and is original.

[btrwtr]

Two more pictures. The feature mentioned re: the small blade is also present on the large spear blade. I believe the knife has never been apart and is original.DE-5.jpgDE-6.jpg

Here is a picture that shows the dip in the pen blade back where it would meet the back spring. You should be able to see the gap against the ruler at the bottom of the picture. This in itself doesn't mean much other than It is very unusual for a blade back not to form a straight line. Are you saying that the master blade is like this as well?

I'm not sure what the capital letter "T" means on the DE stamped blade but that is a feature seen on DE knives that have the word hardware spelled out rather than abbreviated HDWE or HDW. Maybe this is a clue to what company made the knife for Shapleigh. Maybe someone here knows.

[98src]

Yes the master blade is the same. Did you not see my latest pictures?

[btrwtr]

Yes the master blade is the same. Did you not see my latest pictures?

Yes, I did see them but I can't really see that the back of the master spear blade is curved like the pen blade is. It looks to be straight in the first pic as far as I can tell. Maybe we are talking about two different things. This knife could be one of the many old knife mysteries never to be solved.

[Thomasg]

Here is one I fished of the bay .master blade is griffon , secondary blade is western states .a Frankenstein 4 sure .lol still yet the blades have great snap tight and the knife is functional .some nice bone and razor sharp .good for E.D.C. .

Frankenstein knife

[1967redrider]

I was not aware that Western supplied pocket knives to Shapleigh.

[btrwtr]

I was not aware that Western supplied pocket knives to Shapleigh.

I don't know that they did or that there is any proof of it out there. As zzyzzogeton said Western did make knives for Shapleigh but it doesn't naturally follow that they made pocketknives as well.

[Thomasg]

What is the cover material ? Is it wood ? Looking in the the knife makers who went west catalogs I cannot find any western states pocket knife offered with wooden handles .also I only have one W.S. Built on a bare head frame .the master blade and pen knife both have a slight over lap in the 90 degree position where they met the bolster but are perfectly aligned and on the run up where they meet the springs .the run up at the springs where the blades meet on your knife look uneven to me in your picture . .I can’t find a match to the frame of your knife in the catalog pictures in the knife makers who went west, but the selection in the book is limited and the frame could maybe be found from another source of information. Good luck on solving your mystery.

[zzyzzogeton]

The more I look at the OP knife and look at my records and documentation, I more I am convinced that this knife has been cobbled together, most likely replacing the smaller pen knife blade with a Western States pen blade.

I can find no pictoral evidence that Western ever used a long skinny FLAT END shield. Long skinny oval ended yes, flat ended no.

Also, it appears that the OP knife has wood handles. Possibly even cocobola based on the grain appearance.

Western did not have any wood handled knives until the xW66 in 1941, followed by the W49 Bowies in 1964, the 701/702/703s in 1970, the W66/W10 combo in 1975, and the first wood handled folders, the S-53Xs in 1978.

[98src]

The picture clearly shows that the shield is oval on the ends....not FLAT.

[zzyzzogeton]

The picture clearly shows that the shield is oval on the ends....not FLAT.

My error - I typed it backwards - Western's long skinny shield were flat ended NOT rounded. The OP knife shield was never a Western shield.

[Thomasg]

The picture clearly shows that the shield is oval on the ends....not FLAT.

Maybe the knife body on the O.P. Knife is a Winchester ?