More Western Knife Seller Shennanigans
Posted: Fri Nov 04, 2022 6:34 pm
Here's a Black Beauty combo knife set that recently sold for $115 of fleabay. Disclaimer - I did NOT buy this set. Too many issues from a "collector" view point and I got tons of users. I tend to use "BB" for "Black Beauty".
And here's a picture of the set dismounted -
In and of itself, that's a pretty good deal for a 1950 No. 84 Combination sheath and a pair of used BBs. The combo sheath by itself is "rare" enough to justify a look, despite the discoloration damage.
I have problems with the way this combo set was marketed - the auction title reads
Vintage Western "Black Beauty" F48A & F48B Knives with Leather Sheath- Rare set!
So what're the problems?? After all, the knives are BB F48A and F48B knives, the sheath is leather and all 3 were made by Western.
First off, the set is so rare that this is probably the ONLY set like this in the world. It is a frankenset - meaning that the parts of this set were combined to create a matchup that was never a factory offering.
The sheath is a 1950 No. 84 Combination sheath. From the factory, these were sold with a pair of bird & trout knives - an 48CAP and 48BBG with orange, red or ivory plastic handles. The 1950 catalog shows a RH sheath, but obviously, they were also available as LH sheaths as well. Later combination sheaths had the traditional Western oak leaf/acorn pattern stamped on them.
The second issue is knives with stamps used from 1955 to 1967 being mated with a sheath made in 1950 and NEVER mated with a BB knife in the company's history. BBs were not introduced until 1956 and from the gitgo had black sheaths.
Here're pics of the two ricasso stamps -
The last issue is a generic BB/sheath issue. BBs were only marketed and sold with BLACK dyed sheaths. BBs were never sold with tan/neutral/brown/rawhide sheaths. Any such marriage is a frankenset.
A final note on this sheath in particular - the original keeper straps have pulled free (originally bradded near the knobs) and replaced with a single pair of slots through both layers of leather that are misaligned and hence unuseable for either knife of the combo.
Enough on this soap box.
And here's a picture of the set dismounted -
In and of itself, that's a pretty good deal for a 1950 No. 84 Combination sheath and a pair of used BBs. The combo sheath by itself is "rare" enough to justify a look, despite the discoloration damage.
I have problems with the way this combo set was marketed - the auction title reads
Vintage Western "Black Beauty" F48A & F48B Knives with Leather Sheath- Rare set!
So what're the problems?? After all, the knives are BB F48A and F48B knives, the sheath is leather and all 3 were made by Western.
First off, the set is so rare that this is probably the ONLY set like this in the world. It is a frankenset - meaning that the parts of this set were combined to create a matchup that was never a factory offering.
The sheath is a 1950 No. 84 Combination sheath. From the factory, these were sold with a pair of bird & trout knives - an 48CAP and 48BBG with orange, red or ivory plastic handles. The 1950 catalog shows a RH sheath, but obviously, they were also available as LH sheaths as well. Later combination sheaths had the traditional Western oak leaf/acorn pattern stamped on them.
The second issue is knives with stamps used from 1955 to 1967 being mated with a sheath made in 1950 and NEVER mated with a BB knife in the company's history. BBs were not introduced until 1956 and from the gitgo had black sheaths.
Here're pics of the two ricasso stamps -
The last issue is a generic BB/sheath issue. BBs were only marketed and sold with BLACK dyed sheaths. BBs were never sold with tan/neutral/brown/rawhide sheaths. Any such marriage is a frankenset.
A final note on this sheath in particular - the original keeper straps have pulled free (originally bradded near the knobs) and replaced with a single pair of slots through both layers of leather that are misaligned and hence unuseable for either knife of the combo.
Enough on this soap box.
