All About Pocket Knives

I have to chime in and say thank you for all of the research and information on this thread. I guess I might rock the boat with this opinion, but I have never referred to a contract knife as a fake knife. As you all likely know, Case had contract knives made as well. They are genuine Case products, sold as Case by the Case company, but contracted out to other manufacturers. In my opinion, there are just way too many Russell knives out there (the earlier Russell knives) with the non-centered handle pin configuration to believe someone was cranking out fake Russell Barlow knives by the hundreds in their dimly lit garage . I think we need to be careful not to degrade the contracted Russell Barlow knives. In other words, I can see many collectors running to their knife rolls to see if they have been duped into buying fake Russell knives when, in fact, they are not fake. (If any of you want to unload your Russell Barolows with non-centered handle pins, I'd be glad to take those fakes off your hands for, say a couple of bucks apiece! )

I've been wanting to post this for a while and as it is raining here today. I thought I would work on it. There is a lot of confusion about one series of the Russell Barlow reproduction's. The series of 7 knives is pictured and described in Dewey Fergusons' Romance of Collecting Knives printed in 1978 and is copyrighted by him. You can read what he has to say and also look at the pictures of the knives. While Mr. Ferguson states that there is no definitive way to tell the difference between these knives and the originals, in fact over time it has been discovered that all 7 of these knives have the rear pin towards the bottom of the knife. Jerry I know you are handy doing that and perhaps you could circle the rear pins on the 7 knives to show the difference in location between these knives and the originals and other reproduction's. Also note these were not authorized reproductions and Dexter Russell caused production of these knives to cease. Also note this is the series of knives that has a standard size Russell with no "R" on the bolster and also has the daddy Barlow with the off color bone that really stands out from other Russell's. These knives are often billed as old, authentic, and original. They are none of the above. They were made in 1971 and sold for less than $20. What you do see today is that these knives are bringing better price that the Schrade or Colonial Russell reproductions. I suppose collectors are trying to put together a set of all 7? I'll come back in and add more pics of examples after the original post.

This is a picture of the daddy Barlow of this series with the off color bone posted by Tsar Bomba. Notice the rear pin.

Another one that is currently (10 21 19) for sale on Ebay.

This is a good picture of the knife in the series without an "R" on the bolster. Notice the location of the rear pin.

Thanks for the identifying information on my granddaddy Russell repro. I always figured it was a newer model but never knew anything substantive. These materials are just what the doctor ordered.

I noticed the rest of the spear blades have more of a standard spear profile while the 601 has a "Zulu spear" style blade. I always thought that was notable regardless of heritage.

I'm assuming the Boker Russell reproductions I posted in this thread (five feathers) were authorized by Russell unlike the 70s knockoffs?

Frost is cranking out Valley Forge, Honk Falls, Miller Bros and others, but I do not see these as "originals" just because he bought the rights to use the tang stamp. In my opinion he's helping create a situation where reproductions could be confused as legitimate antique knives. They might not be counterfeit but they are fakes in my book, they have no connection to the knives made by these companies originally.

They are reproductions made the same way they once were.
I imagine the only difference would be the quality of steel.

Reproductions are fine as long as you're not thinking you're getting an antique knife and paying an antique price for that knife. People get duped all the time on eBay with knives that aren't what they're being sold as.

1967redrider wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 1:20 am Reproductions are fine as long as you're not thinking you're getting an antique knife and paying an antique price for that knife. People get duped all the time on eBay with knives that aren't what they're being sold as.

#1-If it looks too good to be true .............. it isn't genuine.
#2-If the seller does not allow returns or refunds the knife is not real, a re-due or re-pop.
#3-Only buy from sellers with 100% feedback or study the reason why they don't. It could just be from bad buyers, scammers.
I bought a lot of knives from eBay & as of yet never got taken with the three rule approach above.

That should be posted on eBay.

1967redrider wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 12:01 am That should be posted on eBay.

It takes a lot of reading in the fine print on eBay's site but it actually does state all these warnings and more info on what to watch for when making bids or purchases.
A sellers good reputation is your best bet to purchase from when diddling around on the Bay for blades.
I buy from sellers I've been buying from for years.

blade objective wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 12:35 am They are reproductions made the same way they once were.
I imagine the only difference would be the quality of steel.

Actually they are not, unless by "made the same way they once were" you mean they have blades, bolsters, springs and liners. Otherwise the patterns being made now and stamped with those hallowed names are mostly not the same patterns, materials or quality as the originals. The new ones come in materials and IMHO hideous colors never produced by the original companies.

I agree with redrider's previous post - I find the Frost "reproductions" to be nothing more than a blatant and shameful attempt to capitalize on those old brand names. (However I guess in some ways it's good that the newly made knives are so obviously different that even a semi-knowledgeable person would know they're not authentic originals.)

If someone wants to make a quality knife that stands on its own merits, create a new brand name. Don't try to run a scam operation off the reputation built by a now-defunct company. Unless you're going to honor that reputation by putting the name on a product that respects the quality and tradition the name represents, don't use the name. The Camillus-made reproductions of original Remingtons, and the current Maher & Gross reproductions are examples of how it should be done if one is going to use old company brand names.

JMO. Sorry for the somewhat off topic rant.

Ken

Mumbleypeg wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 12:59 am

blade objective wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 12:35 am They are reproductions made the same way they once were.
I imagine the only difference would be the quality of steel.

Actually they are not, unless by "made the same way they once were" you mean they have blades, bolsters, springs and liners. Otherwise the patterns being made now and stamped with those hallowed names are mostly not the same patterns, materials or quality as the originals. The new ones come in materials and IMHO hideous colors never produced by the original companies.

I agree with redrider's previous post - I find the Frost "reproductions" to be nothing more than a blatant and shameful attempt to capitalize on those old brand names. (However I guess in some ways it's good that the newly made knives are so obviously different that even a semi-knowledgeable person would know they're not authentic originals.)

If someone wants to make a quality knife that stands on its own merits, create a new brand name. Don't try to run a scam operation off the reputation built by a now-defunct company. Unless you're going to honor that reputation by putting the name on a product that respects the quality and tradition the name represents, don't use the name. The Camillus-made reproductions of original Remingtons, and the current Maher & Gross reproductions are examples of how it should be done if one is going to use old company brand names.

JMO. Sorry for the somewhat off topic rant.

Ken

It's like you read my mind, Ken.

And before I forget, to AAPK blade objective, lots of great info here for us knife enthusiasts!

John

1967redrider wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 2:40 pm

Mumbleypeg wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 12:59 am

blade objective wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 12:35 am They are reproductions made the same way they once were.
I imagine the only difference would be the quality of steel.

Actually they are not, unless by "made the same way they once were" you mean they have blades, bolsters, springs and liners. Otherwise the patterns being made now and stamped with those hallowed names are mostly not the same patterns, materials or quality as the originals. The new ones come in materials and IMHO hideous colors never produced by the original companies.

I agree with redrider's previous post - I find the Frost "reproductions" to be nothing more than a blatant and shameful attempt to capitalize on those old brand names. (However I guess in some ways it's good that the newly made knives are so obviously different that even a semi-knowledgeable person would know they're not authentic originals.)

If someone wants to make a quality knife that stands on its own merits, create a new brand name. Don't try to run a scam operation off the reputation built by a now-defunct company. Unless you're going to honor that reputation by putting the name on a product that respects the quality and tradition the name represents, don't use the name. The Camillus-made reproductions of original Remingtons, and the current Maher & Gross reproductions are examples of how it should be done if one is going to use old company brand names.

JMO. Sorry for the somewhat off topic rant.

Ken

It's like you read my mind, Ken.

And before I forget, to AAPK blade objective, lots of great info here for us knife enthusiasts!

John

Thanks for the info and welcome.
I was a member years ago with the other popular knife forum but faded away from collecting.
Rejoined that other forum a few months ago but found it not like it was.
Full of a lot of very ignorant arrogant members who are full of you know what.
I ask a legit question about a particular knife brand and was treated like a mentally challenged person with wise cracks.
That type of forum is not for me so I came here.
So far I've gotten adult intelligent answers from AAPK which is the forum I am in looking for.
I'm guessing, hoping all the members I used to know on that other forum migrated to this one?

I only buy antique knives 100 years or older from reputable sellers.
I doubt there are many old new stock around which brings up red flags with these knives.
And if there are any still around I wouldn't be able to afford them anyway.

blade objective wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 6:41 pm
I only buy antique knives 100 years or older from reputable sellers.
I doubt there are many old new stock around which brings up red flags with these knives.
And if there are any still around I wouldn't be able to afford them anyway.

You should post some pictures here, we would love to see what you've collected. Plus we're all about sharing and learning from others on this site.

Found this at a garage sale in an old cigar box full of knickknacks. Ask the lady what she wanted for it and she said that I could just have it. It was pretty rusty so I cleaned it the best I could without ruining the patina. Honestly, I wasn’t sure what it was but I remember seeing a pic of one on Bladeforums. After a lot of research, I was pleasantly surprised at how old it was. The main blade has no snap but I can still feel the half stop. The smaller blade snaps like it was new after the cleaning.

https://i.imgur.com/gy6VuEs.jpg

Looks pretty legit to me, nice find!

to AAPK too!

1967redrider wrote: ↑Wed Jun 09, 2021 1:55 am Looks pretty legit to me, nice find!

to AAPK too!

Thanks redrider. AAPK is where I found the majority of the Russell Barlow information. Great site. Hope I can contribute in some way.

Mumbleypeg wrote: ↑Fri Oct 25, 2019 12:59 am

blade objective wrote: ↑Tue Oct 22, 2019 12:35 am They are reproductions made the same way they once were.
I imagine the only difference would be the quality of steel.

Actually they are not, unless by "made the same way they once were" you mean they have blades, bolsters, springs and liners. Otherwise the patterns being made now and stamped with those hallowed names are mostly not the same patterns, materials or quality as the originals. The new ones come in materials and IMHO hideous colors never produced by the original companies.

I agree with redrider's previous post - I find the Frost "reproductions" to be nothing more than a blatant and shameful attempt to capitalize on those old brand names. (However I guess in some ways it's good that the newly made knives are so obviously different that even a semi-knowledgeable person would know they're not authentic originals.)

JMO. Sorry for the somewhat off topic rant.

Ken

I have seen with my own eyes new in the box at the store China Buck knives broken in the box they came in. I have seen China Schrade knives "New in the box" and broken.... Do quality knives come from China... ...Yes. My Ganzo folder is an outstanding knife for the price. Would I buy a China Queen... or a China Buck? No!

I think (hope) this is a true Russell Barlow, it seems to pass the tests outlined previously. Really hard to find one without a pin crack or two, but the price was right.

Auction pictures, not mine.

Looks good to me.

edge213 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 5:52 pm Looks good to me.

Thanks!

1967redrider wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 6:13 pm

edge213 wrote: ↑Sun Jun 13, 2021 5:52 pm Looks good to me.

Thanks!

You are welcome sir.

Lovely old gentleman.

Loved reading my through all 5 pages a Russell barlow is one of my grail knives , I'm amazed with how many fakes there are thanks for all the information