All About Pocket Knives

Okay, so to make a long story short I bought this knife from a guy who found it in the trash. For how much, only he and I will ever know.

At first glance I knew this knife was odd. The body appeared to be made entirely of silver at first. I then ruled that out because I didn't see any tarnish. This knife is very old I thought, there would be some tarnish if it were made of silver. Pewter was my next guess.

I took the knife from pawn shop to pawn shop. From pawn shop to jeweler. After coming up with absolutely nothing for my efforts I took to asking random strangers if they, or anyone they knew could help me.

After a stroke of luck I met a fantastic guy who just so happened to be the knife expert I was looking for.... Or so I thought...(I won't use his real name here until I get his permission) For now I'll call him Greg.

Greg was the knife expert I had been looking for. He had been on the cover of Blade magazine three times. He was extremely knowledgeable, and helpful, and came up with a few useful bits of information.

My intriguing pocket knife was most certainly a knife that was presented in the world fair. But from what year exactly we're still unsure. The current theory is sometime from the early 1900's. Craig told me at the ring around what used to be the compass was almost certainly gold. I'll take his word for it, seeing as how he's a Jeweller, and that's how he makes his living.

Greg directed me toward this forum to try and find that one expert. That obscure and elusive individual who will know EXACTLY what this is, and where it came from, and most importantly it's value. In his search Greg was offered a sum of money and rightly refused the offer. First off he'd be a fool to sell something like this not knowing it's true value. Secondly it's not his to sell. It's mine. Thirdly, Greg didn't take me to look like a fool.

Take a good look guys. I am posting the best pictures I have to this date. If you need better quality pictures please say so, and I will do my best to accommodate.
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Welcome to AAPK.

I’m not the “expert” you’re looking for but usually some of the most pertinent information about a knife’s origin and value comes from markings on its blades, and the knife’s condition including the blades. Which you have not shown. Please post pictures of the knife with blades open, and assuming there are markings (stamps), clear in-focus pictures of the markings. If there are no markings, in my opinion that does not bode well for the value. If no one is proud enough of it to stamp the maker’s name on it, it’s usually not worth much.

Ken

Pretty cool little knife. It seems like the compass end of the scale swings out so the compass isn't so affected by the steel blades. I wonder what the other circular device is/was? I am also intrigued by the little compartment that appears to open on the other side. The knife appears to be coined (stamped) aluminum and I would seriously doubt there is any gold involved, the ring around the compass looks like brass. I see no reason it would be made for any expositions, there are thousands and thousands of stamped aluminum handed knives out there and although some were made for expos most weren't and those that were often had an expo theme or writing on it to identify it as such. Like Mumbley says, photos of the blade markings will help and I would like to see a photo of the little compartment open. The style looks like something from Germany or Austria. I do not think it will be a desirable or high dollar value knife. Very cool, just not highly sought after which drives value.

The other circular device is a magnifying glass that I was trying to demonstrate with a pack of cigarettes. I will post pictures with the blade open ASAP. Yes there are markings on it. The stamp says Friedrich Wilhelm. Will post pictures ASAP

Based on the cigarette pack photo, it appears that the second circle (the one w/o the brass/gold ring) is a magnifying glass and that portion of the handle pivots out so you can use the magnifier. It’s a strange one.

Welcome by the way...

Dennis
Whoops, posted before seeing your 2nd post Stone.

I apologize my photography skills are not as in tune as my mechanical skills. I trust Greg in the assessment of the Ring Around The Compass being gold. I say this mainly because the compartment on the opposite side has a bit of corrosion that is similar to what I've seen on brass piping/ fittings or valves. Ring encircling the compass has no corrosion, and has a different luster then the compartment on the opposite side that I know for fact is brass. As for the handle being aluminum I'm not sure. But it's definitely not stamped. This particular company is known for handmade knives. In the steel forged in the old style of blacksmithing. For this is the gist of what my understanding is of how to company operated. They would use different materials such as Ebony or bone. What they considered silver back then is different from the sterling silver that were used to seeing today. I'm not entirely convinced that it's not made of silver. I did have it tested at a pawn shop, I'm not entirely sure if the results would be the same for a piece as old as this. Is as I said before what we consider silver today is something totally different from what was considered silver in the early 1900s in and late 1800s.

Oh and thank you for welcoming me into the fold Dennis.

Thanks for the pictures showing more details, and the blades. I took the liberty to enhance your pictures a little - hope you don’t mind. I was not able to find anything in my reference books about any maker named Friedrich Wilhelm but from the knife’s appearance and the stamp, as Gunsil said, most likely of German or Austrian origin. From the blades I’d classify the knife loosely as a “sportsman’s” pattern. The handles possibly commemorate a location or city. The compartment may be for snuff. The dome-shaped structure embossed on the end looks like a bee hive. Can’t make out all of the inscription on the banner over the woman (who appears to be standing on the globe/world) but “ALLE WELT” is German, and translates to “worldwide” or literally, “all the world”.

Nice little knife with some unusual and unique features, obviously used but not abused condition. Hard to find any comparable from which to establish value. It may disappoint you but my estimate on value is $75 -$100. Maybe more to someone who identifies with the location or event being commemorated. I could be wrong.

Ken

What are the words down around the compass?

Someone look up Hartkopf is that listed in Goins. Maybe went by other names or changes names? Is it possible Hartkopf is under Fredrick Wilhelm on the tang stamp?

The company Friedrich Hartkopf has a long tradition. Founded in 1890 by Friedrich Wilhelm Hartkopf in Solingen. Hartkopf is specialized on producing handmade pocket knives. Due to their high quality Hartkopf knives are known all over the world.

I agree with Mumbley that it is a "sportsman's" knife, for campers and outdoorsmen. I also think his price range is probably correct. I don't understand why you think the handles aren't stamped out, they most certainly were. A steel die was engraved with the design in reverse and then the steel die stamped out the aluminum scales. Just like coins are made. Dies are also used to strike out brass, silver, and many other metals for handles on pocket knives. Regarding silver, why do you say silver is different now than the late 1800s-early 1900s? Pretty much all countries had silver standards set by 1800, and by the late 1800s silver was marked for content. The metal on your knife looks like aluminum, we have looked at thousands of aluminum and genuine silver (usually sterling) handled knives and are familiar with the way they look. This knife is not a one-off custom knife, and I am sure if you take it to a jeweler the compass ring will make green foam with nitric acid indicating a copper alloy. Brass is a copper alloy and comes in many colors and hues. It is a very cool knife, just not maybe what you and "Greg" think it is. If you doubt all of us and are truly curious you can contact Bernard Levine, America's leading antique knife expert. Google him up, he will charge a small fee for his appraisal but it will likely be worth it. He will need good photos of the blade markings too. If you do get an appraisal from Mr. Levine please let us know what he had to say.

I’m wondering about the stubby curved blade. The radius looks to be sharpened so I make that to be a foil cutter for a wine / champagne bottle. The little notch is reminiscent of the notch on cigar tools for prying up the nail used on wood cigar boxes. But what’s the V-notch on the stubby blade for?

Also what’s the rounded protrusion on the side of the knife on the beehive / lighthouse end? This is shaping up to be a fun post for us bored Covid-19 recluses.

Dennis

I can't add anything of value to this conversation.
But, its a really cool knife.
And, welcome to AAPK.

I'm thinking it might be Friedrich Wilhelm Engels. German made. Perhaps the word Engels is lower down on the tang? It would help to know of any other markings on the tangs too. FWE made a lot of razors as well as knives.

It does look like aluminum, especially with the lack of tarnish on the bottom side of the magnifying glass handle piece. Might be German silver too, later known as nickel silver, but that would have a bit duller color. Very hard to tell from the pictures. The first pics have a yellow hue from incandescent lights, and the second set of pics is too dark. You might try taking it outside for pictures any time on a cloudy day, or in the early morning or evening when its sunny (you want to avoid the direct overhead sun glare). Interesting knife!

Eric

Mumbley! Thank you for the translation! Without speaking any German, Greg had suggested that this knife was far to detailed to be any common pocket knife. As I mentioned in my original post, he thought it to be a World Fair knife.

(I think I mentioned that earlier...I'll have to check)

Get it? Your translation comes out as: "Worldwide".

...Worldwide....World Fair?

Could that be a bit of show boating on the makers' part? Saying he is the best in the world? Or that his country is the best in the world? Or any number of things to brag about?

I will take a few more, better lit pictures today when the sun comes up.

StoneEB1987 wrote: ↑Fri Mar 20, 2020 9:59 am Mumbley! Thank you for the translation! Without speaking any German, Greg had suggested that this knife was far to detailed to be any common pocket knife. As I mentioned in my original post, he thought it to be a World Fair knife.

(I think I mentioned that earlier...I'll have to check)

Get it? Your translation comes out as: "Worldwide".

...Worldwide....World Fair?

Could that be a bit of show boating on the makers' part? Saying he is the best in the world? Or that his country is the best in the world? Or any number of things to brag about?

Again, there are thousands and thousands of pocket knives with coined or stamped handles with just as much and more detail in them, they are plain old common. If "Greg" doesn't know that then I don't care how many times he has been in Blade magazine he has certainly not looked at a lot of old pocket knives. This knife was mass produced, and not likely for any expositions. Again, ask Bernard Levine.

Just to elaborate on what Gunsil has said, do a search here on this site for “figural”. That will find literally pages of pictures and information about knives similar to yours, having stamped metal handles. Some are fairly simple, some are very complex and elaborate.

The search function can be found on the left hand side of the header, under Quick links. Just click there and scroll down to “Search”.

Ken

Whatever it is, Dr. Howard Melnick would have loved this knife.

He was an avid collector of "gadget" knives.

See LG-IV, pages 295 and 296.

Charlie Noyes

.........that is quite a knife!!!.................. ................

I find it interesting that no one has mentioned what appears to be a broken blade in the knife.

I'm also, once again, amazed that one's preconceptions deny them the discretion to accept the opinions of learned people.

No offense to anyone intended.

Charlie Noyes

Never even noticed it before, Charlie. Looks like it may have been a file/manicure blade.

RobesonsRme.com wrote: ↑Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:38 pm I find it interesting that no one has mentioned what appears to be a broken blade in the knife.

Charlie Noyes

Not sure that is a broken blade - maybe it is a short screwdriver head ? - just a guess but seems to go with the rest of the included blades/implements...

Or maybe I am looking at the wrong part of the knife ... is the broken file closed in the handle?

The OP did not mention a broken blade and posted no pictures of the knife with that blade open. Broken blade appears to be here:
Bob, sorry I didn’t see your prior question about translating the words by the compass ring. Some letters are worn off but I’ll try to figure out what they might be. My German translation skills aren’t what they used to be. Maybe Tom (TPK) will see this and lend a hand in translation. Here’s the best I can do with the existing pictures.


Ken

Ok so where so I start? (This will be a long post.)

Ken sent me some improved or enlarged pictures of the words on this knife asking for some translation help.If you could post those pictures again in this thread Ken that would be great. It could be useful for other translators or detectives in the future.

In my opinion, this little knife is packed full of symbols. To fully understand the makers thoughts, you not only need to understand the written words but also the symbols used.

Anyways, this is my take (& my wife's) on the words.

The "Lady" Who is standing on a globe (representing the world) is holding a ribbon the reads "Feur ALLE WELT"

Feur means "for" and is normally spelled "für" but since not alle languages have letters with dots over them like ü, the ü can be substituted with the letters eu. So "Für & Feur" are both the same word and mean "For".

ALLE = All, the Entire, the Whole

WELT = World

So: "Feur ALLE WELT" "For the whole world!" or "For the entire world!" (Could relate to the suggested "World's Fair")
Furthermore, I also interpret that the latter words being written in all capital letters is to emphasize their meaning.

On to the next text.

(Keeping in mind that the German letters from the past were often written in a type of "calligraphy" they do vary in from from the present day letters) That being said, we read the next set of letters as: "Meine Heimat"

"Meine Heimat" = "My Homeland" or my country but my homeland is a more fitting translation.

And the last set of letters is anyone's guess. It could be Seacpy or Seaept or Seaen or Seacn or who knows?
Trying to figure this out I thought it could be a person's name, it could be the name of a place or colony, it could be the name of a ship, it could be a different language like Greek or Latin? I just can't tell.

As I said before, to understand the thoughts behind the design, you would have to include all the symbols.
The symbols that I could see were...,

1) "The Lady" what does she stand for? Lady liberty???

2) She is holding an Ankor. What does this mean? I'm sure you can find many definitions for this & the rest of the symbols.

"The Anchor – A Symbol of Hope, A Symbol of Steadfastness
That cross within an anchor is a symbol of masculinity while the crescent moon within the symbol is feminine, representing the womb. It is symbolic of hope in how when lifted up from the water of a port, it represents a new adventure, a new voyage."

"No matter if you have sea legs or not, you can appreciate the deeper meaning of the anchor symbol - security, stability, and being grounded. It is a symbol demonstrating that a person is in tune with themselves and hold on to the values they believe in."

3) The globe she stands on. Is she on top of the world ?

4) The two ships. ? Or a passenger ship & a barge?

5) The lighthouse. ?

6) The ribbon. ? "The ribbon is a symbol of awareness and support. It was originally used in the early mid-1900s in a United States."

7) The crossed hammers. ?

"Within our cemeteries, it is common to find among different symbols objects that may reflect either the profession of the buried person, or act as a reference to their affiliations or membership (i.e. Freemasonry). They may also represent their hobbies, leisure or fields of interest. A hammer is often found on graves of carpenters, though it may also be used to symbolise the power of creation.
A hammer crossed with a sickle, however, would obviously have a communist meaning."

8.) The train off to the left of the lighthouse. ?

9) Three birds off to the right of the lighthouse. ?

10) The beehive. ? Ancient symbolism— “The beehive has been used as a symbol for thousands of years,”

11) The olive branches. ? And other ornamental leaves. ? Could these be tabacco leaves?

"The olive branch is a symbol of peace or victory allegedly deriving from the customs of ancient Greece, particularly regarding supplication to both the gods and persons in power, and is found in most cultures of the Mediterranean basin."

Obviously you could find many meanings for all the symbols used.

Coming back to the suggested "World's Fair" idea.

just bob said "The company Friedrich Hartkopf has a long tradition. Founded in 1890 by Friedrich Wilhelm Hartkopf in Solingen. Hartkopf is specialized on producing handmade pocket knives. Due to their high quality Hartkopf knives are known all over the world."

The World's Fair of 1893 was held in Chicago. http://www.mormonthink.com/glossary/worldsfair1893.htm#


"Eighteen ninety-three was heralded as the end of the frontier era as the world gathered in Chicago to celebrate civilization."

"The Parliament of Religions at the Chicago fair, which Smith claims “received more media attention and applause than any of the other congresses,” was designed to gather faiths with “brotherly sympathies any who are groping, blindly, after God.” Nevertheless, the Mormons — who Smith says expected to be invited — “were deliberately excluded.”

The Mormons were in Utah. Utah was at the Fair but the Mormons were not invited although freedom of religion was one of the themes of the fair. The beehive is found in many religious symbols and throughout the symbols of Utah.

Anyways, was this a knife from the 1893 World's Fair. Meant as a tribute to "The New World", the USA, the promise land, the land of milk & Honey, the start of the industrial revolution, freedom of religion ect. ?

So, I did a little translating & a whole lot of guessing. If you made it this far, Thanks for reading.

Excellent research and an excellent post, Tom!!
For me, all the "could be, might be" adds to the coolness of the knife.
Thanks for the time you put into this.