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A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:27 pm
by Quick Steel
On a custom made folder the contact between blade and spring is almost invisible, virtually seamless. On a lark, I decided to investigate what might be the case with production knives. The results can only apply to the specific knives I investigated. Any generalizations would be unwarranted.
I chose a Queen, Camillus, Case, Bulldog, and an older Colonel Coon. From left to right:Bulldog, Queen, Camillus, Case, Colonel Coon
All the knives functioned well. Unfortunately, camera, lighting, and photographer conspired to prevent adequate photos from directly overhead or from the side. As it turned out, the Colonel Coon [BELOW] had the closest to an imperceptible contact.
The Queen was next followed by the Bulldog and Camillus. The Case had the largest gap of this particular group, but it was perfectly acceptable.
The best alignment of blade with spring seemed to me to be, again, the Colonel Coon followed by the Case.
I think it is evident that this comparison signifies little if anything other than for these knives. But I found it an interesting study.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:30 am
by Sharpnshinyknives
Quick Steel wrote:On a custom made folder the contact between blade and spring is almost invisible, virtually seamless. On a lark, I decided to investigate what might be the case with production knives. The results can only apply to the specific knives I investigated. Any generalizations would be unwarranted.
I chose a Queen, Camillus, Case, Bulldog, and an older Colonel Coon. From left to right:Bulldog, Queen, Camillus, Case, Colonel CoonP1030010.JPG
All the knives functioned well. Unfortunately, camera, lighting, and photographer conspired to prevent adequate photos from directly overhead or from the side. As it turned out, the Colonel Coon [BELOW] had the closest to an imperceptible contact. P1030018 (2).JPG
The Queen was next followed by the Bulldog and Camillus. The Case had the largest gap of this particular group, but it was perfectly acceptable.P1030010 (2).JPG
The best alignment of blade with spring seemed to me to be, again, the Colonel Coon followed by the Case.
I think it is evident that this comparison signifies little if anything other than for these knives. But I found it an interesting study.
QS. Compare a Moki or any Seki made knife to those. It will put them all to shame. But you know that already, you have followed my Moki,Mcusta, Al-Mar thread. I am very surprised at the Colonel Coon being so tight. That one is pretty impressive. JerryD mentioned the other day that they call that meeting point the “run up”.
I have noticed that Case is pretty off on the run up, unless it’s a Tony Bose collaboration, then it’s pretty close to Moki,but not quite there. This will be an interesting thread to follow. I think the run up is an important distinction on a knife. As you said it doesn’t affect the performance. But that attention to detail and tolerances impresses the heck out of me. I know I have a high quality knife when that is tight.
SSk
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:22 am
by marcellusW
Interesting.
Now I will be checking knives left and right!
A new characteristic to check.
Thanks, I think.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:27 am
by Dinadan
QS - I have been interested in the run up for a while. I think it says more about the intent of the maker than the actual quality of the knife. I am posting five examples, none very old.
First is an A G Russell knife made in China. Pretty much perfect.
Second a Case. Pretty good.
Third a GEC. Pretty good.
Fourth a Hen and Rooster. Pretty bad.
Fifth a Boker. Really bad. And yet the Boker was a special edition, carefully boxed as a showpiece of Boker's knife making. I guess Boker just likes it that way.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:49 am
by Quick Steel
Mel, I was inspired to start examining the run up by seeing some of the knives of Sharpnshinyknives and Iman also. The good photos you took really show the differences. The AG Russell simply confirms his great emphasis on quality control. The Boker of course is a disgrace. Did that one come out of Solingen? I did a quick check of my Bokers: very good to excellent fortunately for me.
But I would reiterate that at this point generalizations would be risky. Maybe someone will be inspired to take, say, half a dozen of a particular brand. Perhaps a pattern or trend would be revealed.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:24 am
by royal0014
dad gum you boys are picky .......
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:02 pm
by Doc B
Will have to pull out a few this weekend and take some pictures, too. Does anyone have any observations, on how tang wear, over time, affects this?
I have to confess, I had one new GEC, that the fit was near perfect; yet, the angle, off the back of the two blades was so acute / sharp...it felt like a chisel ,when the blades were in the closed position. I took a dremel and slightly beveled / rounded. That left it with the less-than-perfect fit of the AG Russell above and made it look more like the 2nd OP (Case). You can also see how the "perfect" Russell has that very sharp 90 angle and the Case is somewhat "polished". So in some regards...maybe the Case is finished a little more? May not look as "perfect" but I found that little difference made it feel way better, when I ran my hand across the closed blades.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:20 pm
by gsmith7158
Just from a few quick observations this morning it looks like the knives with squared bolsters have the smoothest runup. Perhaps the final hafting process affects this more so on rounded bolsters. Operating process doesn't seem to suffer no matter what the runup looks like. Had to take my wife to the doctor this morning so I will investigate more later today.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:08 pm
by Steve Warden
For me, "picky" and "price" are directly proportional.
I'm quite satisfied with the knives I have.
Then again, most of my knives are in the $50-60 range. I don't have any knives over $100.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:33 pm
by tongueriver
For pleasure in this department I like to go back and look at my pre-war knives. Otherwise, my Case/Bose collaboratiions.
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 2:59 pm
by Sharpnshinyknives
For anyone not familiar w/ Moki, here are four examples from Moki. The third one is an A.G. Russell, but it was made by Moki. As you can see from all examples, this is comparable to a custom knife that costs 4 to 5 times as much money. Moki has some knives that are just under 100 dollars and most are under 200. For the money you can’t beat the quality.
Al-Mar has the same run up as Moki. I don’t have any but everyone one posted on the Moki, Mcusta and Al-Mar thread have this same seamless run up.
SSk
Re: A MINOR COMPARISON
Posted: Thu Jan 03, 2019 3:15 pm
by Quick Steel
Stray thoughts about this. I wonder if a company having a large production volume such as Case could produce run ups like, for example, Moki without adversely hurting their profits significantly. Then too, what would be the situation for a higher priced but much lower production outfit like GEC? Perhaps someone with insights into knife production would care to comment.