All About Pocket Knives

I picked this mammoth sunfish up over the weekend. It's marked 09 production prototype but doesn't show up in the production totals. Any ideas?

Super looking knife Greg. I hope you find the totals but I'd be willing to bet they didn't make many of those.

____________
Mike

Can't help you, but that's a great looking knife.

Mike, David thanks for the compliments. I wish I could find somebody that might know if it was a rendezvous knife or something.

It is either 1 of 1 or nothing more than 1 of 2. Up to 2009 GEC made two prototypes of each knife, after 2009 they made only one, so it could be hard to tell where yours lies. Prototypes were never listed on production totals.

Russell

Wow! That's great information Russell. Thanks very much.

According to Levine "prototype" properly refers to a new pattern, one that manufacturer has not previously made. Was GEC making 1 or 2 'prototypes per pattern ? or per handle material ?
Greg's 2009 clearly marked "Prototype" has ivory handles yet this was not one of the handle options. I think the double pull master blade is unique to this pattern in 2009. So Greg's knife is the prototype for all double pull #36's and was the first made. How did it get the ivory ? My bet is one of the owners wanted it for himself. It's a heck of a fine pattern and with ivory it is a real standout.
kj

kootenay joe wrote:According to Levine "prototype" properly refers to a new pattern, one that manufacturer has not previously made. Was GEC making 1 or 2 'prototypes per pattern ? or per handle material ?
Greg's 2009 clearly marked "Prototype" has ivory handles yet this was not one of the handle options. I think the double pull master blade is unique to this pattern in 2009. So Greg's knife is the prototype for all double pull #36's and was the first made. How did it get the ivory ? My bet is one of the owners wanted it for himself. It's a heck of a fine pattern and with ivory it is a real standout.
kj

Kj go back and look at monks first post in the thread where you posted your Ivory 46 . There is a exterior mammoth and an interior mammoth #36 DP. I believe I have that same knife that was sold in 2010 by Greg at TSA KNIVES. Here's the link
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=22522#p191646

Greg, compare the 2 'ID Cards'. they are not the same. look at position of ' relative to "P" in Prototype.
So different card = different knife ? most likely ?
what do you think ?
kj

kootenay joe wrote:Greg, compare the 2 'ID Cards'. they are not the same. look at position of ' relative to "P" in Prototype.
So different card = different knife ? most likely ?
what do you think ?
kj

Yes I see what you mean. 3 or more mammoth prototypes? The mystery deepens!

Yes, so far 2 interior mammoth and one exterior 'bark' mammoth. I think you have many of us on the search for the other 2 mammoth 36's from 2009.
There is a lot of interest right now in the GEC toenail patterns, the #36 & #46, and especially those with ivory (includes mammoth ivory). It is possible to buy a 36 or 46 with less desirable handles and get it re-handled in ivory and sell it for up to $1000 and thus make a hefty profit. If you do come across an ivory 36 or 46 it would be a good idea to check the GEC "Production Totals" to see if an ivory knife was made that year. Nothing wrong with a re-handled GEC knife as long as it is not represented as 'all original'.
kj

Roland who could or would re-handle a knife? I have 3 ironwood #46's. I was going to keep one as original and maybe sell the others, but the more I think about it I would love to have one in ivory, Mammoth or Elephant. Thanks for the help!

LSS152 wrote:Roland who could or would re-handle a knife? I have 3 ironwood #46's. I was going to keep one as original and maybe sell the others, but the more I think about it I would love to have one in ivory, Mammoth or Elephant. Thanks for the help!

Muskrat Man ( Kaleb) can do that for you --he has done many for me, like the ones below** ( you can find the slabs or he will*) -- highly recommend
https://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/catalog/muskratman

kootenay joe wrote:According to Levine "prototype" properly refers to a new pattern, one that manufacturer has not previously made. Was GEC making 1 or 2 'prototypes per pattern ? or per handle material ?
Greg's 2009 clearly marked "Prototype" has ivory handles yet this was not one of the handle options. I think the double pull master blade is unique to this pattern in 2009. So Greg's knife is the prototype for all double pull #36's and was the first made. How did it get the ivory ? My bet is one of the owners wanted it for himself. It's a heck of a fine pattern and with ivory it is a real standout.
kj

Ken Daniels had a few of the Ivory scales made and sold them to a few that knew about them being made** ( notice he signed the COA ) -- back in the day,there were lots of different knives made, ( low production totals) just for Ken,and he would sell to "preferred collectors" relatives,or friends -- he would also have a short run and give them to dealers,as gifts -- was a lot of fun,trying to keep up with GEC back then !!!!

Big Monk, your explanation of Ken D. having a few special GEC knives made for friends, dealers etc is the info needed to understand the GEC 'oddities' which often are the best examples made.
I have an ivory 72 from Caleb and i concur 100%: absolute top notch workmanship and person too.
Question: is a GEC re-handled in ivory as valuable as the same knife handled in ivory by GEC ?
I think the cutlers who re-handle should mark the knife in a way that indicates not all original.
I predict that we will start to see #36 & #46 patterns re-handled in ivory being sold as 'all original' for prices as high as $1000.
kj

kootenay joe wrote:Big Monk, your explanation of Ken D. having a fcolleew special GEC knives made for friends, dealers etc is the info needed to understand the GEC 'oddities' which often are the best examples made.
I have an ivory 72 from Caleb and i concur 100%: absolute top notch workmanship and person too.
Question: is a GEC re-handled in ivory as valuable as the same knife handled in ivory by GEC ?
I think the cutlers who re-handle should mark the knife in a way that indicates not all original.
I predict that we will start to see #36 & #46 patterns re-handled in ivory being sold as 'all original' for prices as high as $1000.
kj

In the early years,GEC would make a few knives with an odd / new handle material,just to see if they liked it* Some went on to be production runs, while others, were never made again -- the first Primitive Bone run,was just some old cattle bones,someone found in a trash pile*** Turns out to be a great "discovery"" __ The "Red Elk" experiment on the 72 pattern,went sorta bad ( lost about half of the handle material, because of cracking / splitting, during drying process ) they were going to make 50pcs. with Wharncliff blade ( only 26pcs.made) & 50 pcs.with clip blade ( only 23 pcs. made ) -- one & only time they dyed the Elk slabs*** __ when / if you find one of these for sale,it will cost ya' $$$$$

A) from my experience, the re-handled knives do not fetch the $$ that a factory knife will bring, but do sell for top dollar$$
B) Muskrat Man does mark his knives on the liners ""I believe"" ,so as to not take away from the knives beauty*
C) I don't think you will see re-handled knives passed off as "factory"" because of the COA signatures & Tubes -- another thing, **all** of GEC's production numbers are listed on their web.site now, ( even the SFO's & short runs ) -- collectors that will pay the big bucks$$$,will want the knife in pristine condition & all the factory signatures & packaging ( I would**)

for awhile,we tried to keep an up-dated list of the knives made for other venders,dealers, clubs, ect. but I;m sure it needs up-dating now**
viewtopic.php?f=56&t=26974

Red Elk photos below

I have those red elk knives in that picture. I cannot remember if I bought them off of you Monk or someone else but I have had them for a while now.

I had a cocobolo 2011 #46 prototype. I got it off Roger Cunningham who supplied the knives that the #46s are based on. Unfortunately it was pawned along with several other of my knives,but not by me. I believe it was sold on eBay . I also had two primitive bones pawned, which may have been sold on AAPK.

I still have this 2011 bark ivory one of, a gift from a good friend.

Wow X 3 !!!
Lyle i covet your knife ! Looks like a #46, correct ? or is it a #36 ?
Is the "good friend" a fellow who lives in Canada ?
kj

It’s a 2011 #46 Whaler Roland, and yes I have some good friends in Canada.

Lyle,
That is one SWEET hunk of Ivory! I would love to see a picture, from the top, of your 2011 knife so we can see how thick the Ivory is, if you get a chance. Sorry about the pawned knives. I hope you ultimately got some satisfaction from that situation.
Larry

While we wait for Lyle to post here is a #46 also from 2011, one of 5 with elephant ivory (the 2011 'Bark' ivory is one of one). A well hafted folding knife does not have thick handle slabs. They are slender and thinned from underside so top surface of antler or tusk can go bolster to bolster. This is best seen with vintage Sheffield folding knives.
Showing it with a #36 from 2009 just for a helpful comparison of size & shape. You can see the ivory pieces on this knife are slender. What is important is that the edges be nicely 'rounded' all along edge where meeting the liners. This has been very nicely done on this knife. Rounding is needed for a natural in hand fit. The "bark" pieces are usually thicker but don't need to be. I hope Lyle will post a top-down view of his.
kj

Thanks for posting yours, kj. That is what I was curious about.

BTW, I should have first said "absolutely fantastic knives"!!

Just saw the question. I’ll try to get a top view. The handles are not thick. I expect Bill did a lot of the ivory work, but not sure.

Just saw the question. I’ll try to get a top view. The handles are not thick. I expect Bill did a lot of the ivory work, but not sure.