Cattle knife

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ken98k
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Cattle knife

Postby ken98k » Tue Apr 11, 2017 5:06 am

What does it take to qualify as a cattle knife? I have been looking at them lately and they seem to come in quite a variety.
Some that are called "cattle knives" by their makers appear to be just equal end jacks to me.

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Old Hunter
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby Old Hunter » Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:54 am

Ken, my understanding is that an equal end pattern made with three or four blades (similar blade combinations to the Stockman pattern) make it a Cattle Knife. If it measures 3" to 3-3/8" it becomes a Junior Cattle Knife (my current pocketknife fascination). If the equal end pattern has two blades (either end) it is an Equal End Jack Knife. OH
Deep in the guts of most men is buried the involuntary response to the hunter's horn, a prickle of the nape hairs, an acceleration of the pulse, an atavistic memory of his fathers, who killed first with stone, and then with club...Robert Ruark

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Re: Cattle knife

Postby Old Hunter » Tue Apr 11, 2017 9:58 am

Two 3-3/8" Junior Cattle Knives I have bought in the last three weeks; HSB (Camillus 75 frame) and a real Camillus 75. OH
Attachments
HSB 9729 (mark).JPG
Camillus 75 Junior Cattle Knife circa 1957 (1).JPG
Deep in the guts of most men is buried the involuntary response to the hunter's horn, a prickle of the nape hairs, an acceleration of the pulse, an atavistic memory of his fathers, who killed first with stone, and then with club...Robert Ruark

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KnifeSlinger#81
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby KnifeSlinger#81 » Tue Apr 11, 2017 2:50 pm

Old Hunter wrote:Ken, my understanding is that an equal end pattern made with three or four blades (similar blade combinations to the Stockman pattern) make it a Cattle Knife. If it measures 3" to 3-3/8" it becomes a Junior Cattle Knife (my current pocketknife fascination). If the equal end pattern has two blades (either end) it is an Equal End Jack Knife. OH


I think that sums it up.
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I am looking to trade for old bone or rough black cattle knives. Especially a schrade 856.

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ken98k
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby ken98k » Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:25 am

Kinda what I thought. Thanks. ::tu::

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jerryd6818
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby jerryd6818 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 10:43 am

Thanks for asking that question. I've been wondering the same thing but was just too lazy to ask. Looks like same blade compliment as a stockman but the third blade is "anything other than" a spey blade. Would you say that is a true statement? I think I saw someone say that.
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby KnifeSlinger#81 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 1:54 pm

jerryd6818 wrote:Thanks for asking that question. I've been wondering the same thing but was just too lazy to ask. Looks like same blade compliment as a stockman but the third blade is "anything other than" a spey blade. Would you say that is a true statement? I think I saw someone say that.


I would say there's more to it than that. Cattle knives usually have a spey, but a pen is probably about as common. More so on jr's. Sometimes the 3rd blade is a punch, it can also be a punch as a 4th blade with various combinations of spey, pen, or sheepsfoot. The master can also be a spear. Really they have pretty much the same combinations as a stockman except the spear. A spear would be uncommon for a regular serpentine stockman, but I may have seen it before. Not sure.
-Paul Thomas

I am looking to trade for old bone or rough black cattle knives. Especially a schrade 856.

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Re: Cattle knife

Postby Mumbleypeg » Wed Apr 12, 2017 4:34 pm

Mr. Levine says "As the name suggests, the cattle knife was designed for work on and around livestock.........The master blade of a cattle knife is most often a spear blade, although many, including most Case cattle knives, have clip master blades. A few have sheepfoot master blades. The second blade is usually a spey, while the third can be a sheepfoot, a pen, or a punch."

(The italics are mine to emphasize the spey blade being a usual component.)

Although this cattleman is currently "all hat, no cattle", as someone who has owned and worked cattle for years, I can't imagine a cattle knife without a spey blade. ::shrug:: Even though the last time I used a pocket knife to "doctor" a critter was probably sometime in the 70s.

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Re: Cattle knife

Postby jerryd6818 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 5:46 pm

Old Hunter wrote:Ken, my understanding is that an equal end pattern made with three or four blades (similar blade combinations to the Stockman pattern) make it a Cattle Knife. If it measures 3" to 3-3/8" it becomes a Junior Cattle Knife (my current pocketknife fascination). If the equal end pattern has two blades (either end) it is an Equal End Jack Knife. OH

So it's the "equal end frame" with usually three or sometimes four blades that makes it a cattle knife?
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"The #72 pattern has got to be pretty close to the perfect knife."
--T.J. Murphy 2012

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Mumbleypeg
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby Mumbleypeg » Wed Apr 12, 2017 6:16 pm

jerryd6818 wrote:
Old Hunter wrote:Ken, my understanding is that an equal end pattern made with three or four blades (similar blade combinations to the Stockman pattern) make it a Cattle Knife. If it measures 3" to 3-3/8" it becomes a Junior Cattle Knife (my current pocketknife fascination). If the equal end pattern has two blades (either end) it is an Equal End Jack Knife. OH

So it's the "equal end frame" with usually three or sometimes four blades that makes it a cattle knife?

Without the correct combination of blades, it's simply an equal-end jack. Levinevsays the cattle knife has "the same round-ended equal-end shape as the equal-end jack. At least 90% of cattle knives are standard equal-ends but a few have been made in other shapes." After listing those few shapes making up the 10%, he then goes into the description of the cattle knife's blades, which I quoted above.

So I interpret this to mean it has the equal-end shape, AND the right blades. Like OH says, similar to the stockman. The blades are what differentiates the cattle knife from an equal-end jack. That's the way I read it anyway.

Ken
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FRJ
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby FRJ » Wed Apr 12, 2017 6:24 pm

Here's one.

A Challenge with a clip main blade.
Attachments
DSCN0277.JPG
DSCN0279.JPG
Joe

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jerryd6818
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby jerryd6818 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 6:32 pm

Let me try this one more time. Equal end (rounded bolsters) with most likely a spear main but it could be a clip blade. Sheepfoot. paired with the main blade. Pen blade or punch blade by it's self at the bottom end. Please don't throw anymore shirt in the fan, I'm covered with it already. ::dang:: ::smack:: ::cr:: ::dead_horse::
Forged on the anvil of discipline.
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"The #72 pattern has got to be pretty close to the perfect knife."
--T.J. Murphy 2012

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tongueriver
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby tongueriver » Wed Apr 12, 2017 7:09 pm

All of the above observations are accurate in some measure. To fine-tune it, in case anyone missed it, a cattle knife CANNOT have a serpentine frame. Most stockman knives are also equal end, but they always have a serpentine frame. In addition, there were two major standard sizes, and all other sizes are rare and anomalous. Those two sizes are 3 3/8 (junior) and 3 5/8 (regular). I have a cattle knife by IXL Wostenholm that is also a "true" whittler, with the springs wedged. Speaking of which, why do people call them back springs? What other kinds of springs can a pocket knife have? Front springs? Side springs?
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RalphAlsip
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby RalphAlsip » Wed Apr 12, 2017 7:14 pm

The 2 blade variations are the ones where I don't know if I'm referring to them correctly. For example, I would identify the 2 blade variations pictured below with a blade on each end as cattle knives. I would identify the 2 blade variation pictured below with both blades on the same end as a Jack knife. The one I'm calling a Jack knife is also known as a Cigar knife.

My sense is that "all of the above" are correct :) .
Attachments
Case XX 06245 B #3a small.jpg
Cattle Knife or Jack Knife or both?
Case Tested XX 06245 half B #3a small.jpg
Cattle Knife or Jack Knife or both?
Case XX 6294 Green A #3a small.jpg
Cigar or Jack Knife or both?

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KnifeSlinger#81
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Re: Cattle knife

Postby KnifeSlinger#81 » Wed Apr 12, 2017 7:40 pm

jerryd6818 wrote:Please don't throw anymore shirt in the fan, I'm covered with it already. ::dang:: ::smack:: ::cr:: ::dead_horse::


image.png
-Paul Thomas

I am looking to trade for old bone or rough black cattle knives. Especially a schrade 856.


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