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Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 2:17 am
by peanut740
Those are Case Brothers with 3 pins shown in the Russ Altamore book.That is correct.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 11:13 am
by bonehead
Jerry,
Yes! After reading Charlie's,and your posts regarding the tang stamp.. I was too quick on my decision, my bad.After zooming in, one can see some very odd stuff happening.
I hope others here can give some insight as to why Case used the different pin configurations. It is obvious it was done at some level but why?
I posted and sold a tested XX clasp knife here not too long ago which had (4) pins for the handles and it had raised the same questions....
BH
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 1:42 pm
by peanut740
The reason you see differences in early Case toenails is they were made on contract by someone else(Platts,Napanoch,Utica,maybe others).I believe if a WR Case toenail has 2 pulls it was made on contract.Case Bradford and later toenails were all 4 pins and nail nick pulls.Made by WR Case.
Re: W.R. Case & Sons 8250 Elephants Toenail
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:01 pm
by bernynhel
zp4ja wrote:bernynhel wrote:4 3/8" maybe the notch in the tang was for wire stripping - or a mark for a factory second (more likely - see misstrike co logo tang stamp, last pic) idk for sure - any other thoughts? - Bill
Interesting, same knife is for sale on ebay at this moment.
Bill, you asked for thoughts so here you go...
While I was not around in the early 1900s, it is pretty common knowledge based on the times that companies were very frugal. So if a blade did not have a perfect stamp, it was still used. I personally read the entire knife before the stamp but I do not believe that to be an authentic stamp or a mis-strike/double tap.
Not sure what the tang notch is but I certainly don't believe any knife company would do that on any knife, factory second or not. The strength and integrity of the tang has been diminished by that notch. Just can't see a knife company doing that. Never seen a CASE E-Toe with 4 handle pins but I am no expert so what do I know.
Here are a 8251 from Scott Kings collection that was just at auction. He has some other 8250 CASE pearls listed also...
http://bid.mclemoreauction.com/cgi-bin/ ... more301/14
Jerry
Thanks, Jerry. I thought the tang was notched as a second so that it would not accidentally be used in a finished knife. Idk, either. The WR Case and Sons stamping, at least the undistorted parts, are identical in line height, spaces between lines, line length, and variances between line height of the 3 lines (the middle and bottom line type sizes are slightly larger than the top line) as two other full size Case and Sons knives I own to the .0000 inch so if a phoney stamp, it is dead on. I agree that frugality in commerce was par for the times however your statement that, :...if a blade did not have a perfect stamp, it was still used." a little too bold and covers just a few too many blades for any of us to know what was done with them and what wasn't. It's a fair and probable opinion and one I am inclined to agree with but still just an opinion and, at best, perhaps, an educated guess. I do appreciate your input and welcome any others here or via my listing of the knife on eBay.
-Bill
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:51 pm
by bernynhel
zp4ja wrote:Bonehead my friend, I respect your opinion greatly as you know. You know way more about CASE E-toes than I ever will. That being said, we agree to disagree on this one. A double strike while plausible would imply, at least to me, that the same stamp was struck twice on the knife. I have a few knives where the stamps look different on a double strike. Same stamp was used but struck softer on one strike versus the other so the dyes appeared different, yet they were the same.
I personally do not like what I see in my OP knife read but I certainly respect your opinion, even though we disagree. Authentic, maybe so. But if it were a double strike I would expect the stamps to match even if chipped or damaged. Look closely at the "SO" in the "SONS" portion of the stamp. The second strike has the S and O touching each other, whereas the first strike does not. You know I am not a "stamp reader" and I read the entire knife first. That being said, even if I am wrong and the knife is authentic besides the installed wire cutter (what????), here is what the seller states on ebay..."I believe the notch on the tang was put there to strip wire.
This is a fine, fine example of and extremely desirable and rare knife in 100% original condition."
That being said, in my personal opinion, addition of a possible wire stripper or whatever the hell the person whom put it there was thinking constitutes NOT in "100% Orginal Condition" in my book, as the auction states. "100% Orginal Condition" means to me, as is from factory without alteration regardless of condition. Untampered with or altered, if you will. Maybe that is just me. I also think OP knife is a rehandle.
Just my 200 cents...
Regards, Jerry
Pretty interesting about the stamp - why do you think anyone would try to stamp the tang a second time with a different die from what was used the first time after the first stamp was mis-struck? Moreover, even if not a Case employee but just someone counterfeiting knife tang stamps, why would they attempt the above? Wouldn't even a part time counterfeiter know that any intentional second strike, especially one with a different die from the first, has practically no chance of looking like anything legitimate? Of course you could be 100% correct with everything you said, IDK. - Bill
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Fri Jan 03, 2014 10:59 pm
by carvin don
Not sure if this is considered vintage, but here is a recent acquisition ... IXL George Wostenholm Sheffield England. I have no idea of the date of manufacture, but it is a neat little pen knife.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Sat Jan 04, 2014 8:11 pm
by Miller Bro's
Very nice little Wostenholm Don
I would say it dates from the 50-70`s
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 1:48 am
by carvin don
Thanks for the info Dimitri!!
Mint Remington R6334 Sleeveboard Whittler Master Knife
Posted: Tue Jan 07, 2014 2:38 am
by bernynhel
The lined, glove-grade kidskin case, pictured, is what it was in when I found it. In the 2nd pic, you can see where I was Photoshopping cat hair out of the background and accidentally melted the edge of the blade. Its fine just like in the top pic.
c. 1890-1913 Water-ville Co. 3 1/4" Sleeveboard Pen Knife
Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:24 am
by bernynhel
I remember buying this knife at a yard sale. It was in a jelly jar full of wing nuts, wire nuts, nails and washers along with a small box cutter and one of those souvenir mini-hunting knives that used to be sold from gumball machines for a dime or a quarter. The jar was marked $2,
FIRM.
1904 Mapin Bros. Sheffield Fruitknife
Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:39 am
by bernynhel
This was the declining era of these knives and were mass produced. Sterling silver blade soldered to steel tang, just under 2".
1838 John Law Sheffield Fruit Knife
Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:52 am
by bernynhel
2 23/32" sterling blade, bolsters, cartouche and rosettes, milled spring, the works. Even with the crack its pretty cool.
c.1786-1821 Georgian Fruit Knife
Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:08 am
by bernynhel
Pretty basic but good shape. 2 5/16" Sterling blade and bolsters on steel tang and spring. I read that this King George III duty stamp was used through Geo IV in many instances and even into Queen Victoria (1838-1890) to around 1840.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:20 pm
by Salernoslim
I've seen a few of these for sale on eBay lately. Seemed pretty reasonably priced for such interesting knives. Are there reproductions of this style of knife?
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Sun Jan 26, 2014 11:21 pm
by RobesonsRme.com
This sweet little Henckels was sold on Ebay this past week. I don't think anyone here bought it, so I feel pretty safe in posting the auction photos.
The knife sold in excess of $2700.00!!!
Tiny little thing, about 1 1/8" long.
Not my knife, of course. I just thought it was interesting.
All the pics should expand times 2.
Charlie Noyes
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:45 pm
by Miller Bro's
Nice looking fruit knives Bill
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 6:46 pm
by Miller Bro's
RobesonsRme.com wrote:The knife sold in excess of $2700.00!!!
Crazy money for that one Charlie
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:07 pm
by knife7knut
Miller Bro`s wrote:RobesonsRme.com wrote:The knife sold in excess of $2700.00!!!
Crazy money for that one Charlie
Maybe so Dimitri but we all know the old axiom about value:It's only worth what the buyer is willing to pay and the seller is willing to take. I personally would never have spent that much money unless it was a Henry Frank knife;then I might have been forced to take out a loan.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:24 pm
by Miller Bro's
This is true
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 12:19 am
by RobesonsRme.com
Explain Henry Frank.
Charlie
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 3:10 am
by knife7knut
RobesonsRme.com wrote:Explain Henry Frank.
Charlie
Heinrich H.Frank is(or was;I'm not certain that he is still alive)one of the finest custom knifemakers of all time.He resides in Whitefish MT and is known for doing ALL his own work;i.e. making complete knives inlay work and engraving etc. His knives are more art pieces than knives you'd want to use every day even though you could. I first saw one of his knives in the 1970's and I think it was $6,000 IIRC. At the time if you wanted to order a knife from him,I believe it was about a 10-15 year wait. I remember seeing a set of six knives he made for a customer that took over a year to make and they were priced at $60,000!
I'm sure there are a lot of makers today that equal or surpass his work but to me he is the holy grail of custom knifemakers.I actually got to hold one of his knives many years ago and the workmanship has to be seen to be believed. Here is a picture of one of his knives.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 4:35 am
by roofsc
ooooh awwww , I WANT ONE !!!
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 6:19 am
by knife7knut
roofsc wrote: ooooh awwww , I WANT ONE !!!
I think that one sold for $10,000 a few years back.If I had ten large it would in my hands right at this moment.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Thu Jan 30, 2014 9:49 pm
by knife-nut
That is a Sweet knife. I have never heard of him before. Thank you for posting that. Mark.
Re: Vintage Mother Of Pearl (MOP) Knives
Posted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:39 pm
by knife7knut
Here are some multi-blade pearls that I may or may not have posted before.There is also an unmarked multiblade with horn scales included;it is rare to see one of these knives with that scale material.
Several of these are Adolph Kastor knives and some are missing pieces and far from mint but I like them anyway.Unusual is the one with the engraved pearl scale(National Woolen Co on an eagle).The 13 blade knife is a W.H.Morley made in Austria.The smaller one is marked A*1 Tyler & Co Celebrated Cutlery. The fancy file work on the back of a couple is amazing.