S.C.C. Fixed Blade

[kootenay joe]

This knife is 10 3/8 OAL with a 6" blade, marked on tang "S.C.C." Guard and pommel are steel and handle is stacked leather washers. Full tang, visible at pommel.
The only "S.C.C." i know is Schrade Cut Co. but they made very few ? or no ? fixed blades.
In LG4, page 448-9 he says during WW II many combat utility knives were made for commercial sale and were purchased by procurement officers and individual G.I.'s. Union/Kabar made about 500,000 6" blade knives that "look like scaled down Mark 2's". He says that Case, Camillus,Kinfolks, Queen City, Pal and Robeson made similar knives for non official use by the Military .
Is this a Schade Cut Co knife.
Could this be from early 1940's as described by Levine ?
kj

[kootenay joe]

Does anyone else have a fixed blade marked "S.C.C." ?
kj

[knife7knut]

First one I have seen like that Roland. Sure does seem that the initials would stand for the Schrade Cutlery Co. Following this one.

[zzyzzogeton]

The earliest flat steel pommel knives I know of are the USN-MK2/1219C2 F/U knives, and their smaller relatives, the USN-MK1 as made by Union Cutlery and the "wanna-be Kabars", aka the Western G46-8s, L71 Seabees and the flat pommel G46-6s.

This is the first "S.C.C." fixed blade I have seen. It could be by Schrade, although I have never seen anything in writing that they made knives like these. So this "could" be a Schrade, just that there were very few of them made. Even the low number of Western Parachutist knives, said to be around 500, have seen more exposure that this one.

It could also be something made by someone other than Schrade whose had a name that started with "S" - say Smith Cutlery Company, Sam's Cutlery Company, etc. The have been a bunch of small "flash in the pan" companies that have come and gone.

Whether this is a Schrade made knife or not, the earliest it was made was 1943, since the first flat pommels, Kabar's 1219C2s in December 1942, would have been the influence for it.

[kootenay joe]

Thanks guys. If you read the section in LG4 i refer to above, do you agree it fits in with the WW II FB's with 6" blades made for unofficial military use ?
I once read that SCC did make fixed blades but only a few. Would like to hear from a knowlegeable Schrade person about this.
kj

[Gunsil]

Hi Roland, I do believe this is a WW2 era private purchase knife meant for soldiers. Regarding the maker, I am unsure. I do know that there are a very few fixed blades attributed to Schrade Cut Co but they are marked SCCO, not just SCC. Cal has one of these bone scaled SCCO knives. I do own a lot of various 6" blade knives made for soldier use during the war but have not seen this one before.

[kootenay joe]

Thank you Gene. Quite odd that "S.C.C." on a USA fixed blade has not been seen on other knives.
I have a Schrade-Walden H-15 which has a similar blade profile but is 5 1/4" long, not 6" as on the S.C.C. knife.
kj

[tongueriver]

The H-15 first appeared in catalogs in 1958. The OP knife by Roland is something that I have never heard of.

[kootenay joe]

Thanks Calvin. I feel sure that there are other examples 'out there' in a BARN OR SHED OR OLD storage trunk.
Maybe i have the most rare of all the USA unofficial Military Combat/General Utility knives made during WW II ?
So rare the collector value is close to zero ?
kj

[Old Hunter]

Don’t know the answer, but perhaps a clue from Cole, Book III. Look at this Kinfolks version of the Cattaraugus Commando Knife, same size and style of construction as your knife Roland. Wonder if perhaps what you have is a Schrade prototype of the same style that never made it into production? Or a PX knife. OH

[btrwtr]

I do believe it is a Schrade Cut Co knife. Military years can be very blurry. The high demand for knives produced many uncommon and unusual knives and I think this is one of them.

[tongueriver]

I have always heard that Schrade CutCo (pre-1946) never made a single fixed blade knife, but did sell a few that were made by others. I have two of them. One of them, with the integral guard was definitely a Kinfolks and even has a Kinfolks pattern number right on the knife. The other one defies absolute provenance.

[kootenay joe]

Thanks for all your posts. I have learned from your replies so am glad i posted this SCC knife.
I like Wayne's opinion that it is a Schrade Cut Co knife made during the early 1940's in an effort to make sure every GI had a good fixed blade.
This fits with what Levine says in LG4 pages 448-9 about many USA knife manufacturers making a "Combat" knife with a 6" blade.
But it is odd that other examples have not been seen.
kj

[zzyzzogeton]

Looking at that last "SCCO" knife, I think Roland's knife simply missed out on the "O".

[kootenay joe]

Looking at that last "SCCO" knife, I think Roland's knife simply missed out on the "O".

Good thinking. Why did it not occur to me ? But the "SCCO" marking does not have a period after each initial, whereas there is on my S.C.C. knife.

[zzyzzogeton]

Different stamps made per different specifications.

Someone submitted the work order paperwork for the die manufacture at different times. One person said "Schrade Cutlery Company" = S.C.C. Another said "Schrade Cutlery Company" = SCCO. A third person might have come up with "Schrade Cutlery Company" = SCCo or S.C.Co. or S.C.CO.

The devil is in the details, especially when it comes to something like a die. The maker is going to make a die EXACTLY as requested in the description of the work order. No artistic license allowed. This is how those "rare" versions come about - be it with knives, coins, stamps, etc. Some variations due to mis-made or damaged dies lead to "rare" instances.

[tongueriver]

I agree with ZZ's assessment of the tang stamps. That said, I seriously doubt (opinion coming here, forewarned) that Schrade Cutlery Company made this knife or any other fixed blade knife. Ever. There are multiple scenarios here any of which could be true, but all are only speculation. The only human who knew the story has been dead for at least half a century. Here is a possibility: The war was on, and Schrade was not doing much. They had never made fixed blade knives but were interested in making a little money on government contracts. They had managed to sell a few electricians' knives. They had previously had Kinfolks make them a few fixed blades and asked them to make them a new fighting knife to submit for a bid to the government. So here they had the prototype they submitted. It failed because of their dollar $ bid. Oh, well. Fine; they never were that interested anyway. "We make folding knives, the best in the world." (Yes, they were making superb folding knives in an unbelievable number of elegant patterns). All of a sudden because of the war, this was not working. This rigidity actually cost them the company, because by the Spring of 1946 they were willing to sell out to Albert Baer. All thoughts welcome here.

[kootenay joe]

It is in the style & size of the 'Military Combat Knives' that many USA knife manufacturers were making in the early 1940's to support the U.S. troops entering into WW II. Which company made it is the unknown. And it seems very odd that with all the knife experience of AAPK'ers who have posted here, no one has ever seen a similar knife marked "S.C.C." I really doubt only one was made.
kj