Newer vs. older Remingtons

The Remington Corporation and the knives that they built have influenced the U.S. cutlery industry more than nearly any other manufacturer. From the time America was settled, to the end of WWI, American knife companies struggled to compete with Britain and German imports, but events that occurred during and after the First World War led to a great change in this phenomenon. Unprecedented opportunities arose, and Remington stepped up to seize the moment. In the process, they created some of today's most prized collectables. In an ironic twist, the next World War played the greatest role in ending the company’s domination of the industry.
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tallguy606
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Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by tallguy606 »

I have a bunch of Camillus Remington repro knives. I find them to be very well made, of good materials. I'll probably never own a vintage Remington bullet knife, maybe never even hold one. I was wondering -- if older knives are superior to Camillus copies, in what ways are they better? Materials, fitting, finishing, design, etc? Thanks
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espn77
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by espn77 »

That's truly a matter of opinion but I think that if you took a 1982 R1123 and an original R1123 and was told you could have only one to use. Youd without a doubt choose the original. I do believe the old steel is superior to the newer steel as far as edge retention. The handle bone is definitely more attractive to me. The snap has a different noise to it that is hard to match. Most of these things are probably bias ideas.
clockman
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by clockman »

Hi, gentlemen. I agree with espn77 there is something very special about the old vintage remington's. I have 2 bullets plus about 60 other remington's and they are all old originals. You can find 1123's or the banana bullets for around $300.00 or so in decent used condition. Hope you can find one some day.The bullets are a big handful of knife. One warning, the original remingtons are very addictive. Once you get one, you gotta have more! Best Regards, Randy
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Mumbleypeg
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by Mumbleypeg »

I agree that the Remington reproductions made by Camillus (before Camillus went bankrupt) are very good knives. My understanding is that they were made using the original Remington tooling - as far as I can tell the designs are identical. I have several originals and several copies - a few are the same patterns. The reproductions’ workmanship, fit and finish is excellent, on par with the originals but certainly not better. Remington made some of the finest cutlery ever produced in the U.S.A.

The main differences are that the originals made by Remington used carbon steel, probably some of the best ever. The copies are stainless steel. For a knife that is carried and used I’ll take good carbon steel over most stainless any day. That’s my personal preference.

The other main difference, as Keith said, is the handle cover material. Most originals are beautiful jigged bone, whereas the copies are jigged Delrin. IMHO you can not duplicate the look and character of genuine bone with any synthetic material. Delrin may well be a slightly more rugged material for the purpose, but aesthetically it can’t measure up to bone. I agree again with Keith - if you have both an original and a reproduction of the same pattern in hand, both knives in the same condition, didn’t know anything about their respective values, and were told you could choose one of them to have, you’ll take the original.

Ken
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AREMINGTONSEDGE
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by AREMINGTONSEDGE »

I concur whole heartedly!!! ::tu:: ::tu::
Rocky, AKA- AREMINGTONSEDGE
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peanut740
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by peanut740 »

Ditto. ::tu::
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by Modern Slip Joints »

It is to be expected that in a form that focuses on collecting pre-WW II Remingtons the collectors will sing the praise of their collections. Since I do not own a pre-WW II Remington and have collected some Camillus reproductions I'll be the contrarian. The collectors may be 100% correct but I'm never paying $300 for a pocket knife. The one pre-WW II Remington fixed blade that I owned in the 1970s did not hold an edge anywhere near as long as my then knew Buck knives so I doubt pre-WW II Remington carbon steel held an edge longer than the 1095 carbon steel Camillus used making the red Delrin handled Remington reproductions. Pinkish red was a poor choice of color to match with old fashioned blade steel but it does make the knives quicker to spot after you lay one down outside. The reproductions Camillus made with 440A stainless steel were made with a variety of side covers including bone. If you have honed your eye for old dye colors then modern dye is going to look, well, modern. Camillus rarely added a choil, the notch that separates the sharpened edge from the tang for easier sharpening. Choils are one little refinement that I expect in more expensive knives. I presume most pre-WW II Remington had them? Camillus did not polish the blades of their reproductions bright. Did Remington? If Remington did but you buy a used one to keep the price down then the polish it had decades ago would be long gone. $300, clockman's number, or $60? Easy choice.

To free up factory space and employees for wartime production all of Remington's knife making tooling and equipment was sold to PAL in 1940 or 1941. A few former Camillus employees still occasionally post here. They have written that Camillus paid for the new tooling that was made to produce the Remington reproductions. Since Camillus owned their new tooling they were free to use it to make knives branded Camillus. Most of the tooling was used to make knives in other Camillus series like the Camillus Classic Cartridge sereies (CCC). The same jigged bone used on the sterling silver Remington Bullet reproductions was also used on the CCC series.
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espn77
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by espn77 »

Interesting post, not exactly sure what to make of it. Trying to figure out if I'm misinterpreting it.
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AREMINGTONSEDGE
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Re: Newer vs. older Remingtons

Post by AREMINGTONSEDGE »

I am still trying to lift my jaw from the floor after reading the last post from Modern Slip Joints! Why would anyone begin a debate or discussion on a topic they have no experience with or knowledge there of. The knives produced by Remington in the 1920’s and 1930’s were manufactured for the common man and or tradesmen. They were reasonably priced for the day’s economy. They were designed to be easily accessible and priced so that a young boy could have the great experience of owning one. They were the leaders of the knife industry in that era for a reason and they guaranteed their product. It is because of the quality and craftsmanship of those original Remingtons that has many today collecting those rare and beautiful knives among many other varied reasons. It is also what drives (in part) the price on such antique knives as well the prices on other antique brand knives. Your willingness or financial availability to purchase knives is personal as with anyone else. I collect original Remington knives but also collect Camillus, Buck, CASE, so on and so on my collection is deep.
I would simply ask that you not be so controversial or judge mental until you do a little more homework. To each their own...
Rocky, AKA- AREMINGTONSEDGE
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