Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Schrade Cutlery Company was founded in 1904 by George Schrade, and his brothers Jacob and William Schrade. In 1946 Imperial Knife Associated Companies, (IKAC; an association of Ulster Knife Co and Imperial Knife Co) purchased controlling interest in Schrade Cut Co and changed the name to Schrade Walden Cutlery. In 1973 the name was changed to Schrade Cutlery. In 2004 Schrade closed due to bankruptcy.

This forum is dedicated to the knives that are the legacy of this company. This forum is not the place to discuss the replica knives currently being imported using the Schrade name.
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KleenCut61
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by KleenCut61 »

May just be a higher degree of finishing for a Scrimshaw , Than the Uh Models, Were you would No see a pin even under Hi magnification , But just my Opinion , Not Really Positive about it , ::tu::
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orvet
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by orvet »

gwelker62 wrote:
Is it possible Camillus made some Schrades with the Swinden key?
No, they could not be assembled without the Swindon machinery. The machinary necessary to set the right tolerances on the hidden pins. Schrade had the only Swindon machinery that was ever produced. The inventor Dave Swindon worked for Schrade.
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ea42
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by ea42 »

Camillus may have just made the clip blade for that batch of scrimshaws, especially if it wasn't part of the regular run but rather a large special order and they need the blades pronto.

Eric
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orvet
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by orvet »

ea42 wrote:Camillus may have just made the clip blade for that batch of scrimshaws, especially if it wasn't part of the regular run but rather a large special order and they need the blades pronto.

Eric

::doh:: I am a little slow on the uptake tonight. I thought we were still talking about the original 8OT. ::dang::

The knives with blades, which are tang stamped with the S.C.C.+ tang stamps, were to the best of my knowledge made at the Camillus factory and some were assembled there, but not necessarily all of them.

Two examples of this are the 898UH and the 885UH; both patterns were tang stamped with the S.C.C.+ tang stamp. Below is a copy of the two S-cards, which detail the manufacturing instructions for both patterns including the tang stamp, the handle covering, blades, types of pins to be used including whether they were to be spun or not. In short it was all the details the Camillus factory workers needed to make that production run of knives according to the specifications of the customer who had ordered it. In this case the customer ordering the knives was Schrade. These knives were finished at the Camillus factory.
SCC+ 898.jpg
Now, there were 8OTs also produced completely at the Camillus factory, however they DID NOT have the S.C.C.+ tang stamp. Instead if you look at the S-card below you will see that these 8OT these were stamped on the mark side of the clip blade: written “Clip M.S.” on the card, and the tang stamp was SCHRADE/U.S.A. 8OT, as detailed in the lower right-hand box of the S-card.
8OT S card.JPG
Here we have examples of knives that were completed at the Camillus factory that had the special S.C.C.+ tang stamp, and we have the 8OT, which was made entirely at the Camillus factory and did not have a special tang stamp. But if you read the card, these knives were made with through pin construction NOT Swinden construction. Look at the lower left-hand part of the card in the first column says: “BOLSTER PIN (2).” The second column gives the die number to be used, and the third column indicates the type of pins to be used: “N.S.” indicating they were nickel silver pens. These were definitely not knives made of Swinden construction, they were obviously through pin construction and they were made in 1986! This is long after we would expect to find a new through pin Old Timer on the shelf at your local knife shop. What we don’t know is where these knives went, they could have been made for export so far as we know, the card just does not tell us those details. But if you look around the card you’ll find even more information about this knife including the fact that the master blade was to be made with a long pull.

So from Camillus’ his own records we see that they made knives of through pin construction for Schrade, both with the special S.C.C.+ tang stamp and the appropriate tang stamp we would expect to find on the given pattern, in this case the 8OT.


Now, there is a third way in which Camillus helped her produce knives for Schrade and that is they would make parts for them so that Schrade could assemble the knives themselves.
In the purchase order #2367, shown below, and dated 4/17/86 we see that Schrade ordered knife blades to be made at the Camillus factory for installation in knives at the Schrade factory. They ordered 180,000 blades; 30,000 of each blade use and the 8OT and in the 34OT. This was enough blades to for 60,000 stockman knives, 30,000 of the 8OT and 30,000 of the 34OT.
Schrade order for 8OT parts from Camillus.JPG
Sometimes it seems like the supply of Old Timers and Uncle Henrys is nearly endless, you can still buy them NIB online. When you look at orders like these you understand why. The S-card for the 8OT is dated February 13, 1986 and then we look at the purchase order for 180,000 blades enough to make 30,000 new 8OTs and 30,000 new 34OTs and we realize it was barely two months later when that order was placed then we begin to get a little bit of an idea of how many knives were made with Schrades name on them!


Eric is absolutely correct, Camillus probably made the SCC 505 blades for the scrimshaw knives, and the reason you don’t see the through pen is that the knives were manufactured in the Schrade factory on the Swinden machinery.
At least that’s my understanding of the way it worked. Eric was a lot closer to what went on in Schrade than I was, (about 3000 miles closer). My information is all secondhand so if I am mistaken, Eric please feel free to set the record straight, with my blessing!
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KleenCut61
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by KleenCut61 »

Local Lore : My Late Step dad Worked in the Walden Plant With a Man who Fed A machine that Stretched Wire Down from 7/16 To 3/8 th , He told me How he would get his finger caught and it would come out 3/8 , :lol: Funny Now that I think about it , with mentioning the Swinden system , Very Indepth and Comprehensive , Having manufacturing purchase orders and invoices Wow !! ::tu::
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by Shearer »

gwelker62 wrote:I've seen a hand full of these unfinished Uncle Henry's and Old Timers come up for sale on feebay. I am making the assumption they are part of the inventory liquidation at the close of business of 2004. The curious part is, they appear to have pin through bolster design as apposed to a swinden key. Did Schrade abandon the swinden key in their latter years? Or am I missing something here?
After seeing your knife and the information Dale supplied it looks like I will be on the search for a 8OT with the pins through the bolsters.

Grant
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gwelker62
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Re: Pin thru bolster on EOD Schrade

Post by gwelker62 »

orvet wrote: ::doh:: I am a little slow on the uptake tonight. I thought we were still talking about the original 8OT. ::dang::
You answered my question regardless of your slowness. :) ::handshake:: I was basically asking if Camillus had the ability to manufacture any knife with the Swinden key.
orvet wrote:Eric is absolutely correct, Camillus probably made the SCC 505 blades for the scrimshaw knives, and the reason you don’t see the through pen is that the knives were manufactured in the Schrade factory on the Swinden machinery.


Which would have lead to my next question, and Eric answered before I asked it. ::nod::
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