the FRONTIER Series
Re: the FRONTIER Series
Sal,
I have found inconsistencies in Frontier’s numbering system before. I found a blade that belonged in a Gunpowder Black handle in a Sundown Yellow handle. This is not really that unusual.
I guess it stands to reason since they seem to have been made by at least three different companies. –
I have S-cards from Camillus that documents that they made some of them. I also have it on very good authority that Imperial made some in their Providence RI factory. I also have in my collection a Frontier that was made with the Swinden Key like the Old Timers. The only machines that could make knives with the Swinden system were at the Schrade factory in Ellenville.
So with three companies making them, someone is bound to mess up something!
Here is the 4625 as listed in the 1975 info sheets from Imperial Knife Co. Inc., Providence RI.
It clearly shows a drop point blade.
Here is a sheet that gives production dates of the various Frontier models. I do not know the source of this sheet, whether it was put out by Imperial/Schrade or compiled years later by some unknown collector.
You will notice that the 4625 is listed from 1979-1983, yet the pic I just posted is from 1975.
Now we have to pause for a history lesson so this will make sense.
Imperial Knife Associated Companies (IKCO) consisted of Imperial, Schrade and Ulster Knife Co. This consortium was formed around the end of WWII, as I recall without looking it up. Albert Baer (the brother of Henry Baer –‘Uncle Henry’), purchased Ulster Knife Co in 1941. In 1963 Albert Baer bought out the last remaining of the stock in Camillus from the Kastor and Wallace families, after the death of Alfred Kastor. This made him the sole owner of Camillus Cutlery Co.
By now you are getting the idea that Albert Baer was a mover and shaker in the knife industry. About 1984, IKCO was reconsolidated to form Imperial Schrade Corp. I am unclear if Albert Baer was the sole owner of Imperial Schrade, or if this cleared the way for that to happen, but as I understand it he eventually was the sole owner of Camillus and Imperial Schrade, making him the most powerful man in the Cutlery Industry, worldwide.
OK, now back to these two different knives with the same model number.
I suspect that either the dates on the sheet is wrong and the knife is a mistake OR The pattern was changed later when Schrade started making the Frontier knives (and I do not know when that may have been, but I suspect it was in the late 1970s or early 1980s). Remember Imperial & Schrade were both part of IKCO before the Frontier line was ever introduced. The first knife in your picture looks like a Schrade 225 or an Old Timer 25OT. I imagine at the end of the model run they had run out of the drop point blade and finished some off with the secondary blade from the 25OT or the 225.
When the company was reorganized into Imperial Schrade Corp, it was decided that they would discontinue the Frontier line, as it was too much direct completion with the Old Timer brand.
There are a number of inconsistencies associated with these knives, I think it has to do with internal differences within IKCO and then Imperial Schrade Corp.
Much of this information comes from a Frontier collector who used to post here on AAPK as GreatScout.
I hope this makes sense.
Dale
I have found inconsistencies in Frontier’s numbering system before. I found a blade that belonged in a Gunpowder Black handle in a Sundown Yellow handle. This is not really that unusual.
I guess it stands to reason since they seem to have been made by at least three different companies. –
I have S-cards from Camillus that documents that they made some of them. I also have it on very good authority that Imperial made some in their Providence RI factory. I also have in my collection a Frontier that was made with the Swinden Key like the Old Timers. The only machines that could make knives with the Swinden system were at the Schrade factory in Ellenville.
So with three companies making them, someone is bound to mess up something!
Here is the 4625 as listed in the 1975 info sheets from Imperial Knife Co. Inc., Providence RI.
It clearly shows a drop point blade.
Here is a sheet that gives production dates of the various Frontier models. I do not know the source of this sheet, whether it was put out by Imperial/Schrade or compiled years later by some unknown collector.
You will notice that the 4625 is listed from 1979-1983, yet the pic I just posted is from 1975.
Now we have to pause for a history lesson so this will make sense.
Imperial Knife Associated Companies (IKCO) consisted of Imperial, Schrade and Ulster Knife Co. This consortium was formed around the end of WWII, as I recall without looking it up. Albert Baer (the brother of Henry Baer –‘Uncle Henry’), purchased Ulster Knife Co in 1941. In 1963 Albert Baer bought out the last remaining of the stock in Camillus from the Kastor and Wallace families, after the death of Alfred Kastor. This made him the sole owner of Camillus Cutlery Co.
By now you are getting the idea that Albert Baer was a mover and shaker in the knife industry. About 1984, IKCO was reconsolidated to form Imperial Schrade Corp. I am unclear if Albert Baer was the sole owner of Imperial Schrade, or if this cleared the way for that to happen, but as I understand it he eventually was the sole owner of Camillus and Imperial Schrade, making him the most powerful man in the Cutlery Industry, worldwide.
OK, now back to these two different knives with the same model number.
I suspect that either the dates on the sheet is wrong and the knife is a mistake OR The pattern was changed later when Schrade started making the Frontier knives (and I do not know when that may have been, but I suspect it was in the late 1970s or early 1980s). Remember Imperial & Schrade were both part of IKCO before the Frontier line was ever introduced. The first knife in your picture looks like a Schrade 225 or an Old Timer 25OT. I imagine at the end of the model run they had run out of the drop point blade and finished some off with the secondary blade from the 25OT or the 225.
When the company was reorganized into Imperial Schrade Corp, it was decided that they would discontinue the Frontier line, as it was too much direct completion with the Old Timer brand.
There are a number of inconsistencies associated with these knives, I think it has to do with internal differences within IKCO and then Imperial Schrade Corp.
Much of this information comes from a Frontier collector who used to post here on AAPK as GreatScout.
I hope this makes sense.
Dale
Dale
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Hi Dale,
Sorry for not responding sooner -- just wanted to say thanks for the input. It's always good to know that there is such a wealth of knowledge available through the forums and solid citizens like yourself.
Best regards,
Sal
Sorry for not responding sooner -- just wanted to say thanks for the input. It's always good to know that there is such a wealth of knowledge available through the forums and solid citizens like yourself.
Best regards,
Sal
- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
A new twist boys; I have a CRAFTSMAN USA #95091 just like the 4625 pictured above that I got in 1981,on the blade it is etched A.C.A. ANVIL EDGE rust resistant..Who made this for Sears???
"On the Road Again"Willie Nelson
- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
JUST LIKE THIStongueriver wrote:My notes at the time: Double Eagle Folding Hunter, measuring 5 1/4" overall. Has two stainless steel blades, one with the Double Eagle etch. And one blade is secured in the open position by the old fashioned 'press here' liner lock. It's the model 4625... The forty six referring to the pattern, the '2' signifying the two blades, and the '5' meaning that it has hardwood, stabilized handles. Included is the unique packaging these were shipped in for a short while; A little white cotton bag with instructions. Main clip blade is stamped FRONTIER, and picture of powder horn. Blade etched FRONTIER, and Double Eagle, with picture of two eagles inside a circle, and TM. On the other side of the same blade is tang stamped 4625/ IMPERIAL/ STAINLESS. Vertically aligned to the right is U./S./A. The brass liner lock works on this blade. The secondary blade has no liner lock and is a large spear. This type is very unusual in a 5.25 inch hunter pattern. The crescent nail nicks are fairly near the blade tips, rather up at the crest of the spine. The bolsters are yellow brass and have no lanyard hole. The one bolster has a cut out to access the liner lock PRESS area.
"On the Road Again"Willie Nelson
- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
I too have a copy of the Craftsman hunter with the spear and clip blade A.C.A. ( Amazing Cutting Action) etch, I had always thought they were made by Camillus totally. Seems to me I was missing the Imperial factory slant.
Russell
Russell
- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Rusty; this is the beauty of collecting knives and being on this site This knife in question and most of my Schrades are GREAT hunting knives.I SCUN OUT A MOOSE WITH THIS PARTICULAR KNIFE,but for deer hunting I CARRY A Schrade 158ot and a 34ot all I need
"On the Road Again"Willie Nelson
Re: the FRONTIER Series
Here's a Frontier hunter I have. I hope yours is as well made as mine.
I am very envious of that big spear on your knife and the liner lock on the clip. Nice knife.
I am very envious of that big spear on your knife and the liner lock on the clip. Nice knife.
Joe
- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Yea, I love the spear, I put this knife up there with the Buck 110 +112 and the Schrade LB7.As far as being tough.
"On the Road Again"Willie Nelson
- ozzie marie
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
I just received this Frontier 4714.
It's a well built 3" lockback with great looking handles
Keith
It's a well built 3" lockback with great looking handles
Keith
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Please visit my store at:
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- garddogg56
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
ozzie marie wrote:I just received this Frontier 4714.
It's a well built 3" lockback with great looking handles
Keith
I have not seen that one Keith!
You may have something they were experimenting with!
I don’t recall those Staglon handles in the Frontier catalogs.
Awesome find & great lookin' knife!
The 4714 should have had black handles.
Dale
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- ozzie marie
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Dale,
The Staglon handles is what peeked my interest in this lockback. I was hoping someone would notice that they were diffrent than the other Imperial Frontier 4714's.
This is what I love about collecting Schrade, Ulster, Kingston and Imperials. You never know what your gona find out there
Keith
The Staglon handles is what peeked my interest in this lockback. I was hoping someone would notice that they were diffrent than the other Imperial Frontier 4714's.
This is what I love about collecting Schrade, Ulster, Kingston and Imperials. You never know what your gona find out there
Keith
Loyalty and Respect are not purchased and owned for a lifetime, they are earned everyday.
Please visit my store at:
http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/ozziemarie
Please visit my store at:
http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/ozziemarie
Re: the FRONTIER Series
ozzie marie wrote:This is what I love about collecting Schrade, Ulster, Kingston and Imperials. You never know what your gona find out there
Keith
That is what makes Schrade/Imperial/Ulster et al collecting so much fun.
As I have often said:
“With Schrade there ain't nothing carved in stone.
The best you can hope is for something etched in Jell-O.”
Dale
AAPK Administrator
Please visit my AAPK store: www.allaboutpocketknives.com/orvet
Job 13:15
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Job 13:15
"Buy more ammo!" - Johnnie Fain
“Evil is Powerless If The Good are Unafraid.” – Ronald Reagan
Re: the FRONTIER Series
I have one just like yours Dog same etch on blade,Craftsman USA knife American eagle SERIES 95091.I also have a small 2 blade with the Craftman tang stamp that is just like the Oldtimer 72OT with white derlin.garddogg56 wrote:A new twist boys; I have a CRAFTSMAN USA #95091 just like the 4625 pictured above that I got in 1981,on the blade it is etched A.C.A. ANVIL EDGE rust resistant..Who made this for Sears???
-"...and he that cleaveth wood shall be endangered thereby If the iron be blunt,and he do not whet the edge,then must he put to more strength....Ecclesiastes 10 10 ;So the good book says
sharpen your knife !!!
sharpen your knife !!!
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Bringing this old forum on the frontier Imperial forward five years. I did not see one of these clasp type so thought I would post a photo. It seems when you find one they are in nice condition
moss
moss
I STAND FOR OUR NATIONAL ANTHEM
Re: the FRONTIER Series
Thanks for reviving this thread. We sometimes forget about some of the newer old ones. I've only got one and it's a bit used, but still a good user.
- tongueriver
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Here is one, a folding hunter with a linerlock. I think the blade combination is unusual. If I can find it, it is available, with the original cotton bag and paperwork.
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Thanks to this thread, my wallet is $9 lighter. In this era of victimization where nobody takes responsibility for their actions, I blame y'all!
Here's the Frontier 3-inch lockback in the All American series. This one had the original factory edge, but there were some linear scratches on the front of the blade. Click all photos to enlarge. I presume this was a salesman's sample. I really like the logo on the shield on this series. Since I'm a low-end collector who likes to use things, I sharpened this blade, going up to 7000 grit, as always. I've been carrying it on and off in my dress slacks to work. Nice and light, with a slender profile.
Here's the Frontier 3-inch lockback in the All American series. This one had the original factory edge, but there were some linear scratches on the front of the blade. Click all photos to enlarge. I presume this was a salesman's sample. I really like the logo on the shield on this series. Since I'm a low-end collector who likes to use things, I sharpened this blade, going up to 7000 grit, as always. I've been carrying it on and off in my dress slacks to work. Nice and light, with a slender profile.
- Quick Steel
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
UDL, I am liking everything about your knife. Has a very striking appearance. Congratulations!
Re: the FRONTIER Series
I recently picked up a Frontier 435 in Colorado -- best vacation souvenir yet. When I got it, the scales were dried and cracked, with a big chip out of the shoulder. I fixed the cracks with epoxy and a good oil, and patched up the chip with a turquoise/chrysocolla inlay. The blade has some flat spots but I'm working those out. The knife is older than me and I'm looking forward to putting it to use again.
This thread has been really valuable in learning the history of my knife!
This thread has been really valuable in learning the history of my knife!
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Looks great! Nice repair job.
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Re: the FRONTIER Series
Here's one I bought several months ago on the auction site for about the cost of a fast food meal, upsized of course.
It was nearly immaculate when I got it, but it's since sliced a lot of fruit, as you can tell from the clip blade.
Click all pics to enlarge.
It was nearly immaculate when I got it, but it's since sliced a lot of fruit, as you can tell from the clip blade.
Click all pics to enlarge.