Elephant Ivory Handles

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Tsar Bomba
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Tsar Bomba »

I've been watching Plumbob's mammoth knives. I just don't know if I can justify the price right now... :(
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by kootenay joe »

T.B., i agree with you about the prices for some mammoth handled knives being 'too high'. Some are more than the price of a custom made knife by one of numerous excellent knife makers. Even with the strong interest in mammoth handled knives, the $500 ones are not being purchased even though they have been listed for months.
I believe i another 1-2 years prices for mammoth handled knives will have settled down to a price that buyers will see as good value.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by QTCut5 »

In some cases the high price tag is as much or more a reflection of the 'rarity' of a knife as well. Surely a model that is one of only two ever made is worth significantly more than a knife that is one of even a relatively short production run like 25 or 30, regardless of the handle material. It is essentially a factory custom which is why the price is similar to a custom. The fact that it also has very nice mammoth ivory handle scales only increases the value that much more.

BTW--Plumbob will negotiate on prices. I got both of the mammoth ivory knives I bought from him for substantially less than the advertised price. There's no rule against asking for a lower price or making a reasonable offer. Many dealers automatically overprice knives to maximize profit potential which allows them to have some degree of wiggle room to negotiate, especially on high priced knives that have been listed for a long time without selling. It never hurts to ask.
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~Q~
We are all just prisoners here of our own device.
In the master's chamber they gather for the feast.
They stab it with their steely knives but they just can't kill the beast.
(Eagles: Hotel California)


~Q~
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by kootenay joe »

"In some cases the high price tag is as much or more a reflection of the 'rarity' of a knife as well. Surely a model that is one of only two ever made is worth significantly more than a knife that is one of even a relatively short production run like 25 or 30, regardless of the handle material. "

I don't think it works quite this way. I don't buy a knife because it is say, "1 of 2 made". I buy a knife because it speaks to me but am not willing to pay extra for it because of a short run.
It is supply and demand but whether 35 were made or 2, that is still a very limited supply.
Only some sellers are asking $500 or higher for production knives with mammoth handles and these seem to be not selling or if selling, then slowly. Mammoth handled knives priced under $400 seem to be selling but unless a GEC they don't get 'snapped up'.
kj
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by QTCut5 »

kootenay joe wrote:I don't buy a knife because it is say, "1 of 2 made". I buy a knife because it speaks to me but am not willing to pay extra for it because of a short run.
That's where we may differ. Although, like you, I don't buy a knife simply because it's rare, if I see a knife I want, i.e., one that speaks to me, that also happens to be "rare" (say, 1 of 2), I am more inclined to pay a higher price for it because I realize I probably won't have another opportunity to buy one. With a regular production knife like from Case or GEC, however, I know that if I don't get the first or second one I find, chances are pretty good that another one will show up for sale eventually. But, obviously that's not as much of a given with a (genuinely) limited production knife; so, that increases it's value to me (value = the amount I am willing to pay...not some intrinsic amount ostensibly inherent in the knife itself...which I do not believe knives possess anyway). A limited supply definitely affects the value of anything, especially collectibles.

In my experience, many people (not all people, obviously) are willing to pay more for a production knife that is somehow more "rare" or unique whether that's due to a limited supply or some other factor. Knives labeled "Prototype," for example, tend to sell for a higher price than the same model knife from a production run of otherwise identical knives. Same is also true of serial numbered knives; lower serial numbers tend to fetch higher prices for some reason. For me, personally, prototype labels and serial numbers (or absurd, so-called "limited" runs of 3000, like Case sometimes does) have never been a relevant factor in my decision to purchase a knife and/or how much I am willing to pay for it. But, if very few knives of a particular type I want were ever made, I will pay more to get one if and when it is available.

~Q~
We are all just prisoners here of our own device.
In the master's chamber they gather for the feast.
They stab it with their steely knives but they just can't kill the beast.
(Eagles: Hotel California)


~Q~
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by kootenay joe »

Knives that were made in very low numbers can result from the manufacturer wanting to use up the last few pieces of a certain handle material. The low number produced does not make the knife desirable. However if a knife is already one that is sought after and it is produced in very low numbers, then there can be higher value due to the few available.
As to serial numbers and "prototype", most experienced collectors are not influenced at all by these things. What does influence collectors is the specific knife itself. Is it a fine example with zero issues ? If so then it is a desirable knife whether the serial # is 50 or 5000.
I am willing to pay a higher amount for a knife that is 'right on' in all regards. "Prototype", low serial # not important; good 'right on' knife is important
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QTCut5
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by QTCut5 »

If I understand correctly, you're saying that you won't buy a knife simply because it is rare. However, you would pay a higher price for a knife you want ("that is 'right on' in all regards") if it were rare (i.e., relatively few in existence) because the rarity ("few number available") adds value to the knife (as compared to a knife that is common or not rare).

I agree with that. That is what I meant when I said, "I don't buy a knife simply because it's rare, if I see a knife I want, i.e., one that speaks to me, that also happens to be "rare" (say, 1 of 2), I am more inclined to pay a higher price for it."
"The low number produced does not make a knife desirable." True, but it does make a knife more valuable. And, I believe the higher value is reflected in the asking prices, thus my observation: "In some cases the high price tag is as much or more a reflection of the 'rarity' of a knife as well."

Although rarity may very well be a deciding factor for some collectors (a lot of people like the idea of exclusive ownership), I don't select a particular knife to buy based on the number that were made or how desirable it may be to others (there are plenty of people who only want something because it's desired by many other people or "popular" which is what creates the phenomenon known as a "fad"). However, I will pay more for a knife that I want if it is "rare" (meaning very few were produced and/or are hard to find for sale). I believe that is generally true of most collectors (of anything); the more rare an item you collect is, the more you are willing to pay for it. The more that people are willing to pay for an item (demand), the higher the asking price will be for that item. Economics 101.

~Q~
We are all just prisoners here of our own device.
In the master's chamber they gather for the feast.
They stab it with their steely knives but they just can't kill the beast.
(Eagles: Hotel California)


~Q~
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by kootenay joe »

I once made a knife. I am not a skilled craftsman so the knife is not very good. But, it is RARE, only 1 knife in existence made by KJ. Do you think this is valuable ? The answer is: NO, because it is not a well made knife. Rarity alone does not give value. This is a point that BRL often made back when he was active on line.
kj
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QTCut5
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by QTCut5 »

kootenay joe wrote:I once made a knife. I am not a skilled craftsman so the knife is not very good. But, it is RARE, only 1 knife in existence made by KJ. Do you think this is valuable ? The answer is: NO, because it is not a well made knife. Rarity alone does not give value. This is a point that BRL often made back when he was active on line.
kj
I agree with you 100%. If a knife is not well made, as you said, then it would not be a knife that I want because it's unlikely that a poorly made knife would speak to me, so it wouldn't matter that it was rare and it's doubtful that it would fetch a high price were you to sell it. The fact that a knife is rare does not make it inherently valuable and does not alone justify a high asking price. My claim that the high price of many of Plumbob's mammoth knives was a reflection of their rarity, carried with it an unstated assumption that the knives were of sufficient quality to be desirable by collectors on other merits besides rarity. I did not mean to suggest that the rarity alone was the single redeeming quality of those particular knives and was the sole reason for the high asking prices. Nor was I making a generalization about the value of all limited production knives being justifiably higher based solely on the lower number available. I would think it's fairly obvious that a poorly made knife is not worth a premium price regardless of how rare it is. But, perhaps I should have stated that assumption when I made my observation. I apologize if that caused any confusion. Thank you for clearing that up.

~Q~
We are all just prisoners here of our own device.
In the master's chamber they gather for the feast.
They stab it with their steely knives but they just can't kill the beast.
(Eagles: Hotel California)


~Q~
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Ivoryman »

Glenngood, I mean Glennbad modded Copperlock
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by kootenay joe »

Nice looking knife !
kj
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by ObsidianEdge »

Great pictures in this thread. I've wanted a vintage ivory knife for years but wasn't able to get one until late this year.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by BWT »

Very nice, looks like it was worth the wait.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Ivoryman »

Fabulous Ulster ObsidianEdge. Beautiful ivory, that's a looker. Congrats. Nothing feels like ivory either.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by galvanic1882 »

One of the best knives on the site in my opinion!!!
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by ObsidianEdge »

Thanks everyone. Mike, that was especially nice. You have some incredible knives in your collection.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

I recently purchased a 3299 1/2 With no handles. More than likely they gassed out and someone removed them all together. The blades are near mint never sharpened. I wanted to put something different on them and a friend of mine suggested mammoth. He had some that he had unearthed and offered his expertise. I also had a 9 Dot 06247 that had busted handles on it. The blades are unsharpened but unfortunately moisture has gotten to them. He had two different pieces of mammoth one he explained had been exposed to the elements thus making it darker. The other which is on the 47 was never subjected to the elements thus making it more white. Both knive turned out great. I’m gonna show the before and after pics.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

The handles for the 47 I don’t have any pictures of it in Raw form.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

Both knives together.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by edge213 »

Jdub, those are great looking mammoth covers.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

edge213 wrote:Jdub, those are great looking mammoth covers.
Thank you. I am pleased at how they turned out.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by espn77 »

That's pretty cool Justin. ::tu::
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

espn77 wrote:That's pretty cool Justin. ::tu::
Thank You Kieth.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Ivoryman »

Jdub, thanks for the step by step photos. Love that. Beautiful scales, great color. I see no pins, how did you get the ivory to stay on, epoxy? Thanks.
Here's one with less color. Lion steel, Elephant ivory.
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Re: Elephant Ivory Handles

Post by Jdub »

Ivoryman wrote:Jdub, thanks for the step by step photos. Love that. Beautiful scales, great color. I see no pins, how did you get the ivory to stay on, epoxy? Thanks.
Here's one with less color. Lion steel, Elephant ivory.
Yes epoxy was used to secure handles.
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