not exactly counterfeit, but...
- tongueriver
- Posts: 6834
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:01 pm
not exactly counterfeit, but...
https://www.ebay.com/itm/113024970623?ul_noapp=true
My letter to seller: "In the summer of 2004 Imperial Schrade went bankrupt. At the sale Stewart Taylor bought all of the old trademarks. Your knife was made for him by Bear and Son of the Atlanta Georgia area some years after 2004, probably about 2007. Your knife has absolutely nothing to do with the old Schrade name or product."
And his answer, suggesting that I am now his "pal." :
"sorry pal ..i have to list the knife as it states on box and handles and tang stamp.... appreciate your interest though ........todd"
I never learn.
My letter to seller: "In the summer of 2004 Imperial Schrade went bankrupt. At the sale Stewart Taylor bought all of the old trademarks. Your knife was made for him by Bear and Son of the Atlanta Georgia area some years after 2004, probably about 2007. Your knife has absolutely nothing to do with the old Schrade name or product."
And his answer, suggesting that I am now his "pal." :
"sorry pal ..i have to list the knife as it states on box and handles and tang stamp.... appreciate your interest though ........todd"
I never learn.
- KnifeSlinger#81
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
I wonder why he thinks it's 1980's. It seems like people just pull random dates out of the air when it comes to knives.
-Paul T.
WANTED: Shapleigh Diamond Edge branded Schrades in good condition.
WANTED: Shapleigh Diamond Edge branded Schrades in good condition.
- tongueriver
- Posts: 6834
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:01 pm
Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
He wants YOU to think it's 1980s.KnifeSlinger#81 wrote:I wonder why he thinks it's 1980's. It seems like people just pull random dates out of the air when it comes to knives.
- KnifeSlinger#81
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
Hmmm, it's not working
-Paul T.
WANTED: Shapleigh Diamond Edge branded Schrades in good condition.
WANTED: Shapleigh Diamond Edge branded Schrades in good condition.
Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
Well, if he omitted the 1980s part, would he be wrong? The knife came from the factory stamped SCHRADE WALDEN USA. I hate the way that some historic names are perfectly legitimately stamped on knives made by completely unrelated makers. I realize that the company name was part of the assets sold when the original maker went out of business. I cannot change the law, even if I dislike some of the outcomes.
I have noted that I am a lot more accepting of the not exactly a fake knife when it is produced by a top notch maker like A G Russell or GEC as opposed to a China factory. I am not sure how Bear fits into that spectrum.
I have noted that I am a lot more accepting of the not exactly a fake knife when it is produced by a top notch maker like A G Russell or GEC as opposed to a China factory. I am not sure how Bear fits into that spectrum.
Mel
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
I sent the seller a message saying an amateur reads the markings, a knowledgeable collector reads the knife. No handle pins = Bear MFG.
I suggested he should post the message so as to give full disclosure. He does not have to agree with what i said. Just post the info and let the viewers decide.
I will be surprised if he does post this info.
kj
I suggested he should post the message so as to give full disclosure. He does not have to agree with what i said. Just post the info and let the viewers decide.
I will be surprised if he does post this info.
kj
- RobesonsRme.com
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
I never had any interest in collecting "ROBESON" marked knives that were made after they went out of business in 1965, I did add two to my collection just to have examples with that tang stamp.
This is a very gray area for me. Someone legally acquires the rights to the name, but the knives are manufactured somewhere other than the original factory by workers that never worked there.
I suppose Jim Parker or Zippo buying Case were completely different situations.
Ford owns Jaguar and I've heard no complaints about the product not being a real Jaguar.
Confusing, is it not?
Charlie Noyes
This is a very gray area for me. Someone legally acquires the rights to the name, but the knives are manufactured somewhere other than the original factory by workers that never worked there.
I suppose Jim Parker or Zippo buying Case were completely different situations.
Ford owns Jaguar and I've heard no complaints about the product not being a real Jaguar.
Confusing, is it not?
Charlie Noyes
DE OPPRESSO LIBER
"...Men may spurn our appeals, reject our message, oppose our arguments, despise our persons ___but they are helpless against our prayers. "
Sidlow Baxter
"...Men may spurn our appeals, reject our message, oppose our arguments, despise our persons ___but they are helpless against our prayers. "
Sidlow Baxter
- TwoFlowersLuggage
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- Location: Stuck in traffic on a highway in Southern California
Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
This is why trademarks are considered "intellectual property" and are bought and sold at such high prices. "A rose by any other name smells as sweet", but a pile of dung named rose is still just a pile of dung...
"The Luggage had a straightforward way of dealing with things between it and its intended destination: it ignored them." -Terry Pratchett
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
A similar situation exists with "hybrid" Boker knives. Made with Asian parts, supposedly assembled in Germany. But Ebay seller says "Made in Solingen, Germany." What does "made" mean? (to paraphrase Bill Clinton) This is obviously trading on the idea of legendary German quality. But buyers should ask, why are these knives half the price of those marked "Solingen" on the tang?
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
What about knives branded "Buck" that were made by Schrade & Camillus ? Do you consider them to be a Buck ? I don't. To me the manufacturer is significant, what the markings say are less significant. Anything can be stamped into a blade tang but the manufacturer gives some idea as to quality of the knife.
kj
kj
- TwoFlowersLuggage
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Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
Contract manufacturing has been around almost as long as people have been buying and selling products. It is simply an extension of the idea that a great artists can employ assistants to work at their direction, and the artist signs the final product with their name, not the name of the assistant. It is a fuzzy gray line when the artist is willing to sign their name to inferior quality work because they know that the mere presence of their name will sell the product. (eg. when Martha Stewart had products at Kmart)
Once again, the Marketing Executives ruin all the good things in the world...
Once again, the Marketing Executives ruin all the good things in the world...
"The Luggage had a straightforward way of dealing with things between it and its intended destination: it ignored them." -Terry Pratchett
- tongueriver
- Posts: 6834
- Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 8:01 pm
Re: not exactly counterfeit, but...
Long before the 2004 bankruptcy of Imperial Schrade, their knives were a merry-go-round of parts, assembly and workmen among Schrade, Imperial, Camillus and Ulster. Two of the best knives Schrade ever "made," were post-bankruptcy, by GEC. Several runs of excellent 'bullet' trappers and switchblades, and then, an almost unknown fixed blade as a collaboration for the Cherokee nation. I own one. Otherwise, post-bankruptcy Schrades have also been Uticas and Bear and Sons, all U.S.A. made by American Workers. There is another... uh... category of Schrades as well, as we know. With the exception of that lovely GEC fixed blade, I collect Schrades made before 1960, with a few exceptions. I certainly have no problem with a seller advertising these 'offbeat' products as long as he tells it like it is.