Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

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Miller Bro's
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Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Miller Bro's »

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knifeaholic
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

That's not a fake...its a new knife as the seller does state. Case has brought back many of the old "family brands" tang stampings and they are using them on new knife issues - Case Brothers, Kinfolks, Standard, and Crandall...maybe others. Case releases new issues with these old names.

That seller does of course sell many, many reworked older knives bt this one is as he states...though I do not know whether the blade is really ATS-34.
Steve Pfeiffer, author of Collecting Case Knives: Identification and Price Guide published by Krause Publications.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Hukk »

::doh:: A blank where a blade is supposed to be - it's not a knife - yet.

This sucker was just put together, it's not a second because it was never completed. I just have a problem with the way this auction is written. If it is not ATS-34, then how are you going to heat treat the blade - well, you're not going to be able to. It's just parts thrown together. ::paranoid::

::dang:: I guess that Case Bros. Cutlery tang stamp looks like it was etched rather than stamped too.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

I did not look at all the pics before but youre right Hukk...the blade is not even ground yet. Case grinds their blades before the knife is assembled of course so someone cobbled this knife out of unfinished parts.

The tang stamp is ok though...that is how they look after the blade comes out of the progressive dies at the factory as I have observed on factory tours.

And it is ATS-34 - Case does use that steel on a few of their premium knives.
Steve Pfeiffer, author of Collecting Case Knives: Identification and Price Guide published by Krause Publications.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Hukk »

knifeaholic wrote:
The tang stamp is ok though...that is how they look after the blade comes out of the progressive dies at the factory as I have observed on factory tours.

And it is ATS-34 - Case does use that steel on a few of their premium knives.
Thanks, good to know, it just did not look right. That would explain why it looks etched. ::tu:: ::tu::
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Miller Bro's »

Hukk wrote:This sucker was just put together, it's not a second because it was never completed. I just have a problem with the way this auction is written.
hukk, I have a problem with the way it is written too!
knifeaholic wrote:That's not a fake...its a new knife as the seller does state.
Actually the seller states it is a "newer" knife and is not sure of it`s age.

Also, why would he list the auction in the Vintage pre 1970 category if it is a new reproduction? ::td::
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

Well it is a FACT that the knife (or I should say the assembled parts) is authentic in that it did come from the Case factory within the past few years. If you don't believe me, send the link to Case and they can show you pictures of the current Case Brothers knives that they produce. Or go to Case's web site and you will see the new Case Brothers knives (not necessarily this pattern since it may have been from a few years ago).

I agree the seller is a slimeball and is trying to misrepresent the knife to some extent.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Miller Bro's »

Steve,

I believe you 100%!

What I don`t believe is this guy suggesting that the knife is a factory second and placing the knife for sale in the vintage category for sale instead of in the modern category. Also suggesting he does not know for sure the age of the knife!

The knife is marked Case Bro`s., to a novice collector he automatically thinks the knife is old due to the early tang stamp. This is what this seller is trying to do is play on a novices inexperience in being able to recognize a vintage knife verses a modern knife. New collectors tend to just look at the tang stamp and believe the knife is old, when in fact it is not.

This brings us to the problem, as I see it, of a knife company like Case re-issuing new knives with old tang stamps. Case is not the only who has done this and won`t be the last. The only reason Case makes knives like this is many collectors cannot afford an authentic early Case Bro`s knife. So they are filling a demand, the problem comes in when a greedy fleabay seller takes these knives and tries to pass them off as vintage, as this seller is partially trying to do.

He is covering himself by stating the knife is newer, but he is not sure of the exact age. Then he lists it for sale in the Vintage pre 1970 category. ::doh:: ::td::
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

Dimitri;

I just wanted to make sure that people out there knew that Case is indeed reissuing knives with the older stampings...you're right that can always be a bit dicey, it would be nice of they would mark the year on them too.

The knife for sale is odd...I wonder how those parts got out of the factory unfinished like that.

And yes this seller is a con man; he is trying to misrepresent this knife. You should see how Bernard Levine cuts this guy apart over on Blade Forums pretty regularly. It's brutal. The seller always has reworks up for sale represented as originals.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Miller Bro's »

knifeaholic wrote:And yes this seller is a con man; he is trying to misrepresent this knife. You should see how Bernard Levine cuts this guy apart over on Blade Forums pretty regularly. It's brutal. The seller always has reworks up for sale represented as originals
With all the fakes and reworked knives he sells How does he maintain 100% positive feedback?? ::huff:: ::dang:: ::shrug::


D
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by troyl2 »

besides case doesnt let 2nds out the door all there rejected parts and finnished knives go to 2 local steel handling plants with a case employee and he personally watches every last piece go through a hammermill ive personally ::shrug:: put 20 or 30,000 lbs of them through the hammermill those where sad days ::shrug::
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by philco »

MILLER BRO`S wrote: With all the fakes and reworked knives he sells How does he maintain 100% positive feedback?? ::huff:: ::dang:: ::shrug::
D
M.B.,
I have a theory about that question. You can only leave feedback if you are the buyer. Once you leave feedback, it cannot be ammended or removed by the buyer.
Anyone who knows the knife is cobbled or fake is not going to buy it. Only the unsuspecting are likely to be bidding and eventually becoming the "winner", and thus becoming eligible to leave feedback.
Most folks leave their feedback shortly after they receive the item, usually after they open the package and give the item the once over.
It usually takes someone a while to find out that what they thought was the real McCoy is in fact bogus. If, by then they have left their feedback, it's now too late to change what they entered.
Still one has to wonder how long an unscrupulous seller can continue to retain a 100% positive rating while preying on the public.

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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Hukk »

philco wrote: Still one has to wonder how long an unscrupulous seller can continue to retain a 100% positive rating while preying on the public.

Phil
On Ebay, it seems as if the % ratings only reflect the last year. I've seen some that had less than perfect ratings in the past now have 100%.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by stockman »

What did ya"ll think of his other knives? The Case with the secondary blade having the pull on the wrong side.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by arathol »

I'm not convinced that the stamp is real. Ole Brett is a known purveyor of fakes and such. The blade is rough cut from stock, its not ground or polished. Why would you stamp the blade before you at least polish off the cut marks from the saw? By the time you get to the finished pruduct the stamp will be worn down to nothing. Besides, a close look tells its done with a pantograph, not a stamp. The curved stamp on close inspection has a lot of little swirls in it, and look at the other stamp, there are quite obvious telltales of where the pantograph engraver started, stopped and changed directions on the sharp corners.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by Miller Bro's »

Arathol,

You are probably correct, it could have been done with a pantograph.

I would think that if this was a factory second that the factory would have ground out the name or stamped it as a second.

Not to say an employee could have taken this stuff home and put the knife together, whatever the case to me the knife is junk!
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by msteele6 »

-

There are some dots at the ends and turns of some of the letters which is indicative of a pantograph, but if you look there are also what appear to be dots in the middles of some of the letters. Pure chance would dictate that some dots would show up at the ends if the dots were randomly distributed.

-
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by arathol »

yes, theres dots in the middle of some. Random chance, yes. Thats where the engraver randomly paused for a brief second. Those dots are what you get if you don't keep the tool moving. They don't have to be at the end of a line, they can be anywhere.


Again, why would you go to the trouble to stamp a blade before you do the grind and polish. The saw-cut lines are deep, by the time you get rid of them and shape the blade and tang the stamp will be almost gone.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

That knife came from the Case factory and the stampings are factory. Compare them to other recent Case knives and you will see.

BTW, at the factory, Case stamps the tang stamping and pattern number at the same time that the blade is blanked out, before the blade is heat treated, ground, or polished. The stamp is deep enough to survive all of that. That's one reason that the insides of the letters/numbers on a Case tang stamping are black.

I have seen blades blanked at the factory and that is how they do it.

This knife is not a second, apparently someone smuggled out the parts or a partially completed knife.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by arathol »

That knife came from the Case factory and the stampings are factory
Sorry, but after seeing the huge number of "altered" blades and knives this guy has pawned off on ebay I have a hard time believing anything he sells is even close to being genuine. He is a very good at what he does, and his work has fooled a lot of people.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

arathol wrote:
That knife came from the Case factory and the stampings are factory
Sorry, but after seeing the huge number of "altered" blades and knives this guy has pawned off on ebay I have a hard time believing anything he sells is even close to being genuine. He is a very good at what he does, and his work has fooled a lot of people.

Why would he go to that trouble to phony a new knife?
Steve Pfeiffer, author of Collecting Case Knives: Identification and Price Guide published by Krause Publications.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by arathol »

Why? He's faked just about everything else so why not this too?

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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by TrentRock »

Come on guys!!!
Where ya been!!!??LOL
It's 1959Brett!!!
He's world famous for franken knives and welding blades :lol:
Buyer beware..IMHO

If you want more info
PM and I'll send ya some links
He did offer an "explanation" of sorts
"More affordable for the collector" :shock:
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by knifeaholic »

I wonder why, then, that he left this particular fake knife unfinished when he finishes off all of his other fake knives.
Steve Pfeiffer, author of Collecting Case Knives: Identification and Price Guide published by Krause Publications.
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Re: Another FAKE Case Bros. Knife

Post by 4ever3 »

I just saw where steve posted a link to this thread. I bought the knife so we'll see what it is all about when I get it, but I believe this knife to be a Case. Only time will tell ::nod::
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