Camillus Remington - A question of quality

The Remington Corporation and the knives that they built have influenced the U.S. cutlery industry more than nearly any other manufacturer. From the time America was settled, to the end of WWI, American knife companies struggled to compete with Britain and German imports, but events that occurred during and after the First World War led to a great change in this phenomenon. Unprecedented opportunities arose, and Remington stepped up to seize the moment. In the process, they created some of today's most prized collectables. In an ironic twist, the next World War played the greatest role in ending the company’s domination of the industry.
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rschuch
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Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by rschuch »

I recently bought a new/old stock 1992 Guide R-1253. It's my first "Remington" and the more I read the more confused I get about the quality of the repos. Some say they're great walk and talk, others say they released a bunch at once "towards the end" of the life of the Camillus Cutlery Co. and those were sub-standard. Does anyone know exact dates/years that should be avoided?
My knife isn't total junk, but it's certainly sub-par. The backspring grinds when I press the release and I know there are shavings in there because there's a decent gap between the handles and the back spring (enough to slip a couple pieces of paper down in there to try and clean it out). In the open position, there's no movement, but the blade doesn't sit flush with the backspring (which rides above it about 1/32"). I have Rough Rider or two and their quality is better than this. Yeah, you get what you pay for, but for $30, 440A steel and delrin handles, I expected a well-crafted knife made with second rate materials, not a crappy knife made with 2nd rate materials, know what I mean?
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by junebug »

HELLO!!

SORRY TA HEAR,MAN!!!
NOTHIN LIKE A LET DOWN ON A KNIFE........GOIN THREW IT NOW MASELF ::facepalm::

I COLLECT THE OLDER "REAL" REMINGTON KNIVES........PRE WW2
SORRY NEVER HAD A NEW ONE,OR DON'T REMEMBER ANY ANYWHO :D ....MY GUESS....YER TITLE SAYS IT ALL..... "CAMILLUS" REMINGTON........NOT A REMINGTON AT ALL......YER DEALING WITH ANOTHER COMPANIES "IDEA" OF REMINGTON QUALITY!!!!!

THEN AGAIN....I KNOW SEVERAL HERE AT AAPK COLLECT AND USE THEM DAILY!!!!!
SO MAYBE THERE IS A "BATCH" OF DUDS OUT THERE?????
HOPEFULLY ONE OF THE GURU'S WILL DROP IN ,AN FILL US IN ON THE REAL DEAL SCOOP! :mrgreen: ::tu::

AGAIN SORRY BOUT YER KNIFE BRO.... ::handshake::
"Because tellin' people , i like having a SPYDIEHOLE sounds sooo much better than a THUMBHOLE"
- Junebug 2016
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RandyFew
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by RandyFew »

If you think that Camillus/Remington is disappointing, try the Bear/Remington. The best thing that I can say is that they're USA made.

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rschuch
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by rschuch »

I'd heard to stay away from Remington, which is why this was my first (and probably last) purchase. I have a couple Camillus and they're decent quality, so I thought I'd be safe, but I guess 1992 was a little too close to bankruptcy time (2007?). If Camillus started making them in 1982, there must be sort of a cut off date at which to stay away. Unless the finishing details are always hit or miss, in which case I'll go back to my Case, GEC and Queens.
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rschuch
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by rschuch »

Found this article on the Bay
http://www.ebay.com/gds/REMINGTON-REPRO ... 733/g.html
and saw a few responses that backed it up, saying that when Camillus closed it's doors, it sold everything to pay it's debts, including factory seconds, parts and half finished knives that are being sold as new and nothing wrong with them. So watch yourself out there!
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by Capt. Farrel »

::hmm:: Hmm, I never had that problem with the Camillus made Remingtons....
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by jerryd6818 »

RandyFew wrote:If you think that Camillus/Remington is disappointing, try the Bear/Remington. The best thing that I can say is that they're USA made.

Randy
+1


As far as the Camillus made Remingtons, I wouldn't stop as early as 1992 but it's difficult to impossible to tell when what was made. If it were possible to tell when they were made I would go up into 2000-2002, but that's just me. The R14 Camillus 72 clones I have are very well made. I have one coming in a couple of weeks that I'm pretty sure was made in the early 2000s so we'll see what that one looks like.
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rschuch
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by rschuch »

Well, the first one wasn't a fluke. I just got another Remington, a 1988 Powderhorn toothpick R1615 and there's the same gaps between the brass liners and the spring, the spring sits a good 1/32" above the blade tang when open (not a big deal), but this one has the added fault of the blade riding up against the brass liner in the closed position. Rubs it pretty badly actually, so much that there's scratch marks on the top 1/4" of the blade.

This is my last Remington/Camillus purchase.
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Mumbleypeg
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by Mumbleypeg »

Having a number of old original (pre-1940) Remingtons and a few of the post 1982 "Remingtons" made by Camillus, IMHO you just have to be reconciled to the fact that what you get in the pre-1940s era versus later eras are generally completely different from a quality perspective. This is generally true whether it's Remington, Case, or other brand. From the late 1800's up to WW II was the golden age of American cutlery, during which the finest quality cutlery in the world was made in USA. It was high quality, readily available from several makers, and inexpensive. You can still find quality cutlery from American manufacturers, but you have to hand select it. Even then the little things like swedged blades, which used to be standard features, just aren't there on the standard high production volume knives from these makers. If you are willing to pay top dollar you can still find some special factory small volume runs that may approach that quality, but don't expect to see it from normal production.

The reasons for this are varied but IMHO the main ones are the passing of those master cutlers, artisan employees, who made the knives during that golden age. It's not just cutlery that has been affected. America has changed, and not necessarily for the better. Whether it's furniture, glassware, tools, etc., the prevailing sentiment amongst today's consumer is buy cheap, foreign made. When it breaks/fails, throw it away and buy another. And some question why the demise of the middle class, the shuttered factories, etc., but that's a topic for another day, another forum.

Just my thoughts on the subject.

Ken
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by AREMINGTONSEDGE »

Ken I tend to agree with your statements. Quality and pride in ones workmanship seems to have become a thing of our parents and grandparents. Today we live in a society of disposability. Make it cheap, buy it cheap. Today you have high cost associated with quality and workmanship but today our economics does not afford most the opportunity to own this level of quality unless one is willing to go in debt.
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rschuch
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by rschuch »

It's a complicated subject. I think most on this forum are educated about knives and what will last and stand the test of time (seeing poor quality handles shrink or peel away from low quality knives and low quality steels rust or need so much sharpening that there's no blade left on antiques) which is why there's a huge section about history of each of the best companies and why the main sellers and buyers are dealing in Case, GEC, Queen, Schatt & Morgan, Boker Tree, Canal St., etc., etc., who make more expensive knives that WILL stand the test of time and usage. The whole point of the post is that, while the Camillus Remington's are relatively cheap, they aren't worth the risk. I really believe these are factory second knives, sold because of bankruptcy, that are being resold as first rate "new/old" stock and dragging the name of the company down because no one thought to mark them as damaged goods before storing the away.

There's always going to be a mix of people who care about what they do and some who just show up to collect a paycheck. Maybe it's more difficult to get the former anymore, I don't know. But it's the responsibility of the company owners to find workers who care and have the skill to do the job right and pay them accordingly and I think there's an educated portion of the public who are still willing to pay for quality merchandise.

I think too many companies are just greedy and send goods overseas to be manufactured for pennies on the dollar. We see it in our knives here, we see it in A/C parts and you name it, and as has been said, it's a disposable economy - it's cheap, but you have to replace it every other year, and there's more money to be made. Is the economy bad? Yeah. But would you pay extra for something you know would last twice or three times as long? Of course, then you're saving money. The economy is slowly turning around and I think if we as Americans can make wise purchases for quality goods, manufacturers will see this and, eventually, focus on the craftsmen who care and have the skill to create what the public wants: great quality knives!!
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by tallguy606 »

I have a half dozen Camillus-made Remington bullet knives and they are all high quality in fit, finish, and materials. I think my newest one is stamped 1999. So my experience is way different than yours. Although I do have one green/yellow handled Remington muskrat knife where the back is very rough, ridges from the brass liner edges sticking up. Like they forgot to finish the back, grind and polish smooth. But everything else about the knife is fine, so it's a user.
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Re: Camillus Remington - A question of quality

Post by AREMINGTONSEDGE »

Just giving my thoughts... I stopped collecting the Camillus/Remington reproduction Bullet knives. I collected all mint, boxed with papers from 1982 through 2001. All of my knives are made with quality and craftsmanship that you would expect from Camillus and of which Adolph Kastor I think would be proud. I do believe that as Camillus drew near to its closing due to bankruptcy in 2007, production and quality could be in question not to mention the integrity of those who bought the shelf stock and unfinished knives and inventory and put together knives for a quick profit I can't say I know to much about the ACME United Corp.. As much as I love Remington knives I do not support overseas production and as far as Bear and Sons making Remington knives, I'm not impressed! I stick to the quality years of Remington from 1920 - 1940. Unfortunately even some of the modern companies such as Case are doing some overseas business and I have seen some funky knives with Case embossed on the shield. I think it rare to find old school craftsmanship and comittment to quality and pride in a USA made product in a society and business arena placing a profit over anything else. Just my opinion.
Rocky, AKA- AREMINGTONSEDGE
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