All About Pocket Knives
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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 8:01 pm 
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I was looking for some feed back on these two steels.Info that I have seen says the CV is a little better steel for edge retention due to the vanadium content, but I know that heat treat means even more. So how does GEC 1095 stand up to Case CV. Thanks for any input


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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:01 pm 
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I know that Case steel is a modified 1095. Since that's all I know about it, I'll stop there.

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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:26 pm 
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http://zknives.com/knives/articles/knifesteelfaq.shtml

/\ check this out. It will tell you almost all you need to know about steel in terms of knives. Some may be better in certain situations than others or the opposite could be true.

Quote:
Knowing the uses you'll put your knife to, and exactly how those uses cause edge degradation, will allow you to make a much better choice of steel, if you generally understand steel properties.


when it comes down to it, if you are not cutting metal with your pocket knife or chopping wood (I hope you wouldn't with a GEC...) it doesn't really matter.

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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 9:43 pm 
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AISI 6150 Medium Carbon Chrome-Vanadium Alloy Steel

USES
Recommended when excellent fatigue and impact resistance at moderate hardnesses is desirable. As a die steel, it should be used only for short run die applications.

TYPICAL ANALYSIS
CARBON……0.52
MANGANESE….0.84
PHOSPHOROUS…0.023
SULPHUR….0.025
CHROMIUM…..1.03
VANADIUM……...0.23

Machinability 85 / 100

TEMPERING ……………………………...300° to 1100°F, hardness Rockwell C-59 to C-35

Caron 1095 Steel

This is a high carbon alloy of the plain carbon steel family. It is intended for high hardness and strength, but also tends to be brittle. Typically used for springs or cutting tools requiring sharp cutting edges such as grass or grain cutting tools.

Machinability is relatively poor for 1095 alloy. It rates at 45% that of 1112 steel which is used as a 100% machinable reference. 45 / 100

Carbon 0.9 - 1.03
Manganese 0.3 - 0.5
Phosphorus 0.04 max
Sulphur 0.05 max

Rockwell C31

so based on the the facts about the two steels (assuming Case actually uses a CV steel that meets AISI standards which, due to their not calling out a specific version of their CV steel, I assume they probably don't) and their makeup, I would personally choose the C due to :

chromium (Added for wear resistance, hardenability, and (most importantly) for corrosion resistance.)
less sulphur (sulpur decreases toughness)
more maganese (An important element, manganese aids the grain structure, and contributes to hardenability.)
less phosphorus (Present in small amounts in most steels, phosphorus is a essentially a contaminant which reduces toughness.)

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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 5:09 pm 
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Hello everyonee. Long time no see. I've been dealing with some health issues and my wife has also, among a couple other problems that's kept me away from the forums. Thought I'd say howdy to everyone while I give an opinion on a question. BTW, thanks Johnnytwoshoes for being the friend that you are. Your a blessing for sure. ::tu::

Now about the Case CV -vs- GEC 1095 carbon question. Knife blade steel edge holding and sharpenablity differs from knife to knife within a single brand not to mention from brand to brand. You may have 2 Case knives for example that are exactly alike and 1 will be a great working pocket knife while the other just has pretty looks going for it. If you had a Case knife and a GEC knife that had blades that were exactly the same in edge retention and sharpening ability, there is still the other differences of what angle of edge is put on each blade that would play a part in making a difference in the 2 knives. A very sharp thinner "V" edge blade will dull quicker than an blade that has a thicker "V" edge. That is with both knives cutting the same material. There are so many different things that come into play when comparing 1 blade -vs- another. Blade steel, it's material make up of carbon content and ect., heat treatment/tempering and all the other things that go into it at the factory are just the first part. And yes they do play a very large part but then when you bring in the human factor of putting the non-factory edge on the blade, that will effect the out come of the comparison between the 2 also. That's just MHO from my experiences with knife blades though. I hope it makes some sense and is of some help.

You all here on AAPK take care and I hope to get back here to the forums as quick as I can. Lord knows I could use the calming effect AAPK gives me when I visit here and talk with all of you guys. Once again I want to thank you personally Johnny for your continued support and prayers even when you haven't heard from me for quite a while. I'll try my best to keep in touch with you as often as I can. God Bless each and every one of you and keep up the good work you all do so well here on AAPK, the most friendly knife site on the entire www.

Aimus


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2011 2:55 pm 
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Great hearing from you, Aimus. Best wishes and a speedy recovery to you and your wife. ::nod:: ::nod:: ::nod::

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:33 am 
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After reading your posts I signed up and did my own little test out of curiosity using a CV case 109 pen knife and a Schrade USA Old Timer 33ot. After digging through the collection I found these 2 knives to have the most similar blades as pictured. After putting as sharp of an edge i could get on them (used the old arm shave test until the hairs popped off easily) I alteranetly ran them equal amounts of times through leather, cardboard and paper. I even included my carry knife (a SOG Twitch II with AUS6) just for fun but it gave out about half way through. Honestly I was kinda rootin for the Old Timer. After about 20 mins of taking my time and trying to be as even and fair as possible the 33 OT finally started to struggle. However, only three 12" paper slices later and the CV was at the same stage and beginning to tear instead of cut. So at this point the CV seems to have the "edge" in my test. Now I decided to see which one would sharpen back to its original edge the easiest. This was a lot easier than I thought it would be. The CV was back to normal with a few swipes on the stone and a couple of passes on the strop. I had to put almost double the time into the 1095 (33 OT). Of course were only talking a difference of about 40 secs to about 1 minute 20 secs. If both of these knives had the same price tag Id have to go with the Case CV (I also prefer the yellow handle cause I tend to lose thing while coonhunting). But considering that you can get on Ebay and buy 2 or 3 of the 33 OT's for the same as one Case CV 109 Id have to go with the Old Timer. But as Time goes by the good ol' USA made Old Timers are getting harder to come by and ya may have to fork out the 40.00 to get this kind of quality. And in case your wondering I mistakenly bought one of the Chinese made 33 OT's on Ebay just last week. At first glance they are the same quality as far as tightness and snap. But theres a little lighter feel to the Chinese 33 OT. And I have no idea what kind of steel they are using in them but it doesnt hold an edge like the Pre-2004 USA made ones do. Hope this helps guys! I had fun doing it. Now I got a mess to go clean up. Anyone need some confetti?


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 2:56 pm 
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Thanks for the report Hoosierhunter. That's interesting info.

Oh yeah, ::welcome:: to AAPK.


Phil

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 16, 2012 10:15 pm 
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Thanks! ::tu::


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